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While I agree that the Minneapolis city council is naive, the video clip linked in the original post was cut short to misleadingly take the comment out of context. In the full statement, she explained (I’m paraphrasing) that while many people have the “privilege” of expecting that the police will arrive on a scene to protect them, that may not be the case if you are black. (Remember LTC holder Atatiana Jefferson in Ft. Worth?)

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:13 pm While I agree that the Minneapolis city council is naive, the video clip linked in the original post was cut short to misleadingly take the comment out of context. In the full statement, she explained (I’m paraphrasing) that while many people have the “privilege” of expecting that the police will arrive on a scene to protect them, that may not be the case if you are black. (Remember LTC holder Atatiana Jefferson in Ft. Worth?)

Also, disbanding a city’s police department is not without precedent. When faced with endemic corruption or racism in their police departments, a number of US towns have eliminated their city P.D., and paid the county sheriff or state police to patrol their city.

Our house is small. One story and only about 1900 square feet. I cannot imagine having the time during a break-in to actually call 911 before I must engage the intruders. Any call to 911 will be for my own medical help afterward if I'm injured during the attack. Otherwise I'll just call the local police number, maybe 911, just to notify them of the incident and come help clean up.

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:23 pm

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:13 pm While I agree that the Minneapolis city council is naive, the video clip linked in the original post was cut short to misleadingly take the comment out of context. In the full statement, she explained (I’m paraphrasing) that while many people have the “privilege” of expecting that the police will arrive on a scene to protect them, that may not be the case if you are black. (Remember LTC holder Atatiana Jefferson in Ft. Worth?)

Also, disbanding a city’s police department is not without precedent. When faced with endemic corruption or racism in their police departments, a number of US towns have eliminated their city P.D., and paid the county sheriff or state police to patrol their city.

That is true, however the city council likely is not going to be the ones who have the final say on the matter.
https://www.fox9.com/news/defunding-the ... ge-charter

According to the city charter, the council is responsible for the funding of the department -- and is required to maintain a minimum force determined by the city's population -- about 723 officers based on recent population estimates.

The mayor's office is given "complete power" over the department under the charter as well. Currently, the city's budget allows for about 888 sworn officers.

In order to change, the charter, an amendment would require a public vote or full approval of the entire city council along with the mayor.

So I guess it's OK to go burgle the city council president's house now without any consequence?

KC5AV wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:52 am “Yes, it comes from a place of privilege. I’m giving them the privilege of being led away by law enforcement rather than potentially carried away by the coroner.“

There are certain boundaries that when breached, do take that privilege away from the criminals.

When my sister first started as a 911 operator, she was telling up about her training and the way they prioritize calls. The highest level is "In Progress" where the caller is in actual direct contact with a potentially dangerous person. She stopped, looked at me and said "Will I get one of those from you?" I replied "Nope, I'll call for a clean up afterwards."

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:23 pm Also, disbanding a city’s police department is not without precedent. When faced with endemic corruption or racism in their police departments, a number of US towns have eliminated their city P.D., and paid the county sheriff or state police to patrol their city.

From some viewpoints, eliminating the police dept and relying on the Sheriff's dept makes a bit of sense. Sheriff generally being an elected official rather than a political appointee gives the people a bit more say in the dept. I would think that there would still be constables as well to service the various courts, etc. depending on the local setup.

Then again, there's also the San Francisco Patrol Special Police model which I only remember from seeing the movie Kuffs back in the day.

Being an old country boy, I always had more respect for the Sheriff and his deputies than any of the other groups in the county.

https://www.foxnews.com/media/minneapol ... ee-society

Fox News take on it.

Police Free Society.

I spoke at length with an African American officer one time who patrolled my neighborhood. He had recently come from patrolling Acres Homes in Houston. He was concerned he was losing his edge, as nothing happened in my neighborhood. He said in Acres Homes it was non-stop. He said they would get a call and while driving to that call they would pass other felonies in progress. To me if there were no police it would adversely affect neighborhoods of color the most.

I guess the City Fire Department Ambulance Service would need to get larger.

A body is organic, so it would have to go in the trash not recycling.

Hope they cleared with the FDs that they’ll roll solo w/ LE.
I can tell you that my Dept would not respond to DV, suicide attempt, psych., OD etc calls knowing that LE would not clear the scene.

Iunnrais wrote: Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:23 am

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:23 pm Also, disbanding a city’s police department is not without precedent. When faced with endemic corruption or racism in their police departments, a number of US towns have eliminated their city P.D., and paid the county sheriff or state police to patrol their city.

From some viewpoints, eliminating the police dept and relying on the Sheriff's dept makes a bit of sense. Sheriff generally being an elected official rather than a political appointee gives the people a bit more say in the dept. I would think that there would still be constables as well to service the various courts, etc. depending on the local setup.

Then again, there's also the San Francisco Patrol Special Police model which I only remember from seeing the movie Kuffs back in the day.

Being an old country boy, I always had more respect for the Sheriff and his deputies than any of the other groups in the county.

Hennepin County Sheriff's Dept is pretty small I think from looking them up. They're there to guard the courts and jails and patrol unincorporated parts of the county and some Federal installations for local jurisdiction. Think of Dallas County Sheriff vs. DPD.

Yeah. I need to find a new image hosting service. But...

philip964 wrote: Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:48 am https://www.foxnews.com/media/minneapol ... ee-society

Fox News take on it.

Police Free Society.

I spoke at length with an African American officer one time who patrolled my neighborhood. He had recently come from patrolling Acres Homes in Houston. He was concerned he was losing his edge, as nothing happened in my neighborhood. He said in Acres Homes it was non-stop. He said they would get a call and while driving to that call they would pass other felonies in progress. To me if there were no police it would adversely affect neighborhoods of color the most.

I guess the City Fire Department Ambulance Service would need to get larger.

A body is organic, so it would have to go in the trash not recycling.

So I may be the old man out on this but there is a nugget of truth in one of her statements.

She replied: "We've looked at every reason that folks call 911. Why are people in Minneapolis calling for help? And we're starting to pair what's the right response to those calls. In the short term that helps our police officers focus on the work that they're trained to do, while we have a better response to people who have a mental health crisis or a physical health crisis.”

One of the recent Sheriffs in Denton County said that he ran the biggest mental heal facility in the county. I agree with him 100% on that. He also said that society waits for mentally ill people to break the law and then throws them in jail. I agree with that, too. But here comes the problem. Mental healthcare in this country is a disaster. Nothing good in mental health treatment happens quickly and dispensing the medications which are supposed to treat mental health problems is a lot more art than science. For those who are correctly diagnosed with mental problems, there is no long term way to help them deal with those problems. I would bet that the average officer in the street would welcome the opportunity to deal with only the "sane" criminals. The water really gets muddy when you try to separate those with underlying mental issues - bipolar, schizophrenia, etc. from drug induced mental conditions because there are a lot of people with the underlying problems who self-medicate with street drugs. From observing a family member who had no street drug involvement at all try to work the the mental health treatment system, I can say that the success rate was right up there with the weather forecasters.

Dealing with mental health is a laudable goal. Doing that is not mutually exclusive of having a police department. While mental illness problems are rampant, they are far from being the only problems. People get a simplistic view of a complex problem and think that they have all he answers. They don't even understand the questions that they don't have the answers to.

Chaparral wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:13 pm While I agree that the Minneapolis city council is naive, the video clip linked in the original post was cut short to misleadingly take the comment out of context. In the full statement, she explained (I’m paraphrasing) that while many people have the “privilege” of expecting that the police will arrive on a scene to protect them, that may not be the case if you are black. (Remember LTC holder Atatiana Jefferson in Ft. Worth?)

Yeah, that was supposed to be her point, stupid as it was: having no police to call, or not show up, etc. would show you "what it was like to be black."

This whole de-fund the police, has already started. But more of a de-fang the police. This has been accomplished by Soros backed AGs, County, and City Attorneys, decriminalizing, certain offenses, and refusing to prosecute criminals. After a while, the police simply refuse to even make the arrests.

One of the first thing most officials did at the beginning of the pandemic, was empty the jails.

This is all a coordinated, effort to create chaos, and they only needed one incident like the one in Minnesota, to kick it into high gear.

JMHO