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Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

hovercat wrote:Mandatory safety courses in the schools would work, instead. We have mandatory civics and government courses.

I could get behind this compromise 100%. Constitutional carry for everyone over 18, coupled with gun safety and proficiency courses being a required part of the curriculum from grade 3 through 12. Now we just need to get the teachers unions to support this!

ScottDLS wrote:Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

it strikes me odd that folks want you to get training for an inalienable right that is backed by the 2nd amendment.

carlson1 wrote:

ScottDLS wrote:Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

it strikes me odd that folks want you to get training for an inalienable right that is backed by the 2nd amendment.

Me as well....

But what about all those untrained folks carrying under the MPA? We need training for them! And we have ALL heard about the ND and shootouts in current CC states due to the lack of training.

Do it for the kids.

Give. Me. A. Break

We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Arguably there are things more dangerous to us all than the citizenry exercising their RKBA. Reference London yesterday.

Some here are very quick to spout about "They needz more training to carry a gun!"

Stupid drivers, reckless drivers, and drunk drivers are a bigger threat than the RKBA. Swimming pools are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA. School teachers are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

More often than not, those who would require citizens take training to exercise a right are the ones who have taken some sort of training and want the rest to be as tacticool as they perceive themselves to be.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

Note that the phrases used "Common sense gun laws" and "reasonable restrictions" are part of the terminology of the people who seek to [gun] control us rather than allow us to live as free men and women. The use of these phrases might appear to indicate a certain level of acceptance of their methods and agenda, perhaps through their time honored braying long and hard to anyone who will listen. I know anygunanywhere used these phrases in contempt, and appreciate that, but I make a habit of not using such Liberty-averse turns of phrase without identifying them somehow as lacking validity from my perspective.

FWIW, I believe in my heart that firearms SAFETY training is important enough to possibly consider mandating in public schooling. While we are at it, it might be a good idea to mandate a semester or two of shop class so kids can learn to do more than push a button with their digits without hurting themselves or someone else around them. Firearms proficiency training is another thing entirely. It IS definitely important, particularly for someone who considers themselves responsible and therefore worthy of a life of liberty. To mandate proficiency training, though, is to once again put restrictions on a fundamental right.

ScottDLS wrote:Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

What they can not do though is use that AR15 for hunting without a state hunting license and without a state mandated hunter safety course. One could argue that the ability to feed one's family is a constitutional right too. There are so many good arguments for both sides. I guess the clincher is that we allow carry in your car for everyone (that is legal) and there hasn't been a problem. I just wish gun safety would be taught in school at least 2 years before safe sex and that trap and skeet should be offered as sporting events just like football.

rotor wrote:

ScottDLS wrote:Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

What they can not do though is use that AR15 for hunting without a state hunting license and without a state mandated hunter safety course. One could argue that the ability to feed one's family is a constitutional right too. There are so many good arguments for both sides. I guess the clincher is that we allow carry in your car for everyone (that is legal) and there hasn't been a problem. I just wish gun safety would be taught in school at least 2 years before safe sex and that trap and skeet should be offered as sporting events just like football.

I agree, though I'll note that there are/were states where an 18 year old can hunt without taking a safety course. I went bird hunting in New York the year I turned 18 and all I had to do was pay the fee for the license.

rotor wrote:

ScottDLS wrote:Any 18 year old can walk into a sporting goods store and buy an AR15 and ammunition with no training requirement whatsoever. They can then carry it on or about their person throughout Texas without a license. This has been the case with long guns since at least 1836, so what's so special about carrying a handgun (arguably much less deadly) that requires mandatory training?

What they can not do though is use that AR15 for hunting without a state hunting license and without a state mandated hunter safety course. One could argue that the ability to feed one's family is a constitutional right too. There are so many good arguments for both sides. I guess the clincher is that we allow carry in your car for everyone (that is legal) and there hasn't been a problem. I just wish gun safety would be taught in school at least 2 years before safe sex and that trap and skeet should be offered as sporting events just like football.

You need a hunting license to hunt with a handgun as well. I think the more apples to apples comparison is with the same use, namely carry. We have constitutional carry for long guns, but not for handguns.

And I agree with you about the priorities of our educational system. If guns are such a huge risk to children, then why would we not want to educate kids about how to mitigate the danger by learning more about safe gun handling and use? And teaching "guns are bad" should be just as unacceptable to the NEA as it would be to teach that "sex before marriage is bad", aka abstinence.

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Arguably there are things more dangerous to us all than the citizenry exercising their RKBA. Reference London yesterday.

Some here are very quick to spout about "They needz more training to carry a gun!"

Stupid drivers, reckless drivers, and drunk drivers are a bigger threat than the RKBA. Swimming pools are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA. School teachers are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

More often than not, those who would require citizens take training to exercise a right are the ones who have taken some sort of training and want the rest to be as tacticool as they perceive themselves to be.

My statement was no reference to law but to what our own personal standards should be as responsible citizens negating the necessity for such laws.

thatguy wrote:

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Arguably there are things more dangerous to us all than the citizenry exercising their RKBA. Reference London yesterday.

Some here are very quick to spout about "They needz more training to carry a gun!"

Stupid drivers, reckless drivers, and drunk drivers are a bigger threat than the RKBA. Swimming pools are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA. School teachers are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

More often than not, those who would require citizens take training to exercise a right are the ones who have taken some sort of training and want the rest to be as tacticool as they perceive themselves to be.

My statement was no reference to law but to what our own personal standards should be as responsible citizens negating the necessity for such laws.

Show me where I can find the personal standards for responsible citizenship defined and recorded so I can reference them when the need arises and advise me who sets the standard.

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Arguably there are things more dangerous to us all than the citizenry exercising their RKBA. Reference London yesterday.

Some here are very quick to spout about "They needz more training to carry a gun!"

Stupid drivers, reckless drivers, and drunk drivers are a bigger threat than the RKBA. Swimming pools are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA. School teachers are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

More often than not, those who would require citizens take training to exercise a right are the ones who have taken some sort of training and want the rest to be as tacticool as they perceive themselves to be.

My statement was no reference to law but to what our own personal standards should be as responsible citizens negating the necessity for such laws.

Show me where I can find the personal standards for responsible citizenship defined and recorded so I can reference them when the need arises and advise me who sets the standard.

That would be for your own heart to decide brother.

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Interesting perspective. What risk?

thatguy wrote:

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:

anygunanywhere wrote:

thatguy wrote:We have a God given right to constitutional carry, it is self evident. We also have an absolute responsibility to mitigate risk to the public.

Arguably there are things more dangerous to us all than the citizenry exercising their RKBA. Reference London yesterday.

Some here are very quick to spout about "They needz more training to carry a gun!"

Stupid drivers, reckless drivers, and drunk drivers are a bigger threat than the RKBA. Swimming pools are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA. School teachers are a bigger threat to children than the RKBA.

Common sense gun laws and reasonable restrictions are the knife cuts that are slowly bleeding our RKBA to death.

More often than not, those who would require citizens take training to exercise a right are the ones who have taken some sort of training and want the rest to be as tacticool as they perceive themselves to be.

My statement was no reference to law but to what our own personal standards should be as responsible citizens negating the necessity for such laws.

Show me where I can find the personal standards for responsible citizenship defined and recorded so I can reference them when the need arises and advise me who sets the standard.

That would be for your own heart to decide brother.

Agree. I just don't want to live up to someone else's standards.