TexasCHLforum.com

Jaguar wrote: I would rather they just call me "sir". :

Im sure you would.. Too bad that demand of respect only goes one way many times in the videos we see.. So sad some think they can demand respect, when in fact it is earned... or not as all to often viewed.

E.Marquez wrote:

Jaguar wrote: I would rather they just call me "sir". :

Im sure you would.. Too bad that demand of respect only goes one way many times in the videos we see.. So sad some think they can demand respect, when in fact it is earned... or not as all to often viewed.

I was going to write a long reply but this is getting off topic.

As a soldier, make sure you give your ID to any officer who asks for it - at least until Friday for you. After that you may wish to reevaluate the situation at your leisure.

Congratulations on your career.

Jaguar wrote:CB,
Does the 10th Circuit ruling apply to Texas? I thought we were under the 9th circuit court. I can't find anything other than what I posted as applying in Texas.
Just trying to understand, case law seems totally disconnected with the statutes.

Jag,
I'm not an attorney. Looking at the details, it looks like our "region" is the 5th Circuit court. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... of_appeals" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
However, the decision that I referenced is actively being referenced by a senior legal advisor to the Plano Police Department. They're generally pretty well funded and I don't expect ill-considered decisions out of that position. The reference is written and it's probably what the LEOs in DFW are following:
http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/maga ... e_id=42007" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I understand the "am I under arrest" question. Consider the "what crime are you investigating" - which covers the culpable suspicion case also. LEOs are not required to answer either. And you may not be required to provide your identification (verbal or printed).

Of course, we could all just play nice and try to get along, which is probably the best bet... A little mutual respect.

Jaguar wrote: Villagrana-Flores only applies to states with "stop and identify" laws. Since Texas does not have said law, Villagrana-Flores does not apply.

This is what you're seeing:
"In short, if the state has a law requiring suspects to identify themselves when asked to do so during a valid stop or detention, the U.S. Constitution will not bar arrest and prosecution for failure to do so."

Again, I need a little clarity here. Texas does require the people provide ID during a valid (probable cause) stop. We also allow for officers to stop us for culpable suspicion, although we don't have any laws around ID required there...

cb1000rider wrote:

Jaguar wrote: Villagrana-Flores only applies to states with "stop and identify" laws. Since Texas does not have said law, Villagrana-Flores does not apply.

This is what you're seeing:
"In short, if the state has a law requiring suspects to identify themselves when asked to do so during a valid stop or detention, the U.S. Constitution will not bar arrest and prosecution for failure to do so."

Again, I need a little clarity here. Texas does require the people provide ID during a valid (probable cause) stop. We also allow for officers to stop us for culpable suspicion, although we don't have any laws around ID required there...

Yes, that is the part I was referencing. This is becoming clear as mud, as an upstanding citizen I cannot tell when I have to have my name in a report because I was filming something and deemed "suspicious" or "interfering". I will just have to go with Texas Penal Code, and let the courts sort it out - not that I would like that. For the record, this has never happened to me and I don't really foresee it happening. I would just like to know.

Perhaps I should have been a bit more clear. SCOTUS as the deciding court is the Supreme Court of the United States. The US Court of Appeals for Texas and Lou. is the Fifth Circuit. The decision was handed down on appeal from Texas over LEOs authority to compel identification. Identification and the level of identification depends on the situation. If you are jogging in your shorts and no id, you still have to give your name and perhaps answer a couple of questions to verify that you are in your rightout space and not out for a nightly rape. That said, if you wanna give the LEO a hard time and be a wise guy, you could end up spending large amounts of time with the LEO's fellows while they decide on what to do with you.

If you are taking photos of an event which includes investigators, LEOs arresting people or all sorts of enforcement events, the LEOs have PC to demand your identification and address with phone numbers as a potential witness. If you are anything approaching pro as a soul stealer, you should carry business cards with good contact info.

The rules for military are based on orders issued by CnC from the 90s as to no POW on facility except in transit and undercontrol. The id's guide appears to represent the political wishes of local prosecutors who do not like self defense nor anything about POW with civilians or mbrs of the military services. We do get the officials that we elect. 73s