TexasCHLforum.com

RiverCity.45 wrote:

RKirkwood wrote:This has been discussed many times on the Forum but many different answers have been given. If a group as knowledgeable this can't come up with a clear definition what's the chance that an officer that has to deal with all the other laws and regulations is going to know for certain.

For me its not worth being the test case. Ice tea for me.

My thinking, as well.

Actually I think the opposite. Alcohol related incidents are one of the more common incidents a leo deals with and they are very familiar with how they are generally enforced on the street. Unfortunately, the way alcohol is enforced is generally not understood by people reading a B&W statute and that causes good debates and confusion. This really is an issue with other statues as well. There is the letter of the law, what one reads, and the spirit of the law, which is how it is generally enforced. Trust me, people want the spirit of the law vs. a hard head enforcing B&W letter of the law.

Heck I ran into a lady the other night in a 51% establishment boasting about her chl and the fact she was carrying. I had to politely remind her of the law and she quickly ceased and desisted without further incident.

Good cops enforce the law.
Bad cops enforce their prejudices.

texanjoker wrote:Heck I ran into a lady the other night in a 51% establishment boasting about her chl and the fact she was carrying. I had to politely remind her of the law and she quickly ceased and desisted without further incident.

Mind you, I am a newbie to carrying (about 2 months now) but I am the father of 5. I don't have a drink while I am out because I am driving my kids, or my wife, or just me. I won't impair my judgement with a vehicle. I feel the same about carrying... even if I am not driving, I wouldn't have a drink while carrying so that I don't impair my judgement.

Then again, I am not a big drinker. I was given a bottle of Jack Daniels two years ago... MOST of it is still in the bottle. I also bought a 12 pack of Shiner in May.... and there is still a beer in my fridge!

RoadRunnerTR21 wrote:

drumbdummer wrote:Then again, I am not a big drinker. I was given a bottle of Jack Daniels two years ago... MOST of it is still in the bottle. I also bought a 12 pack of Shiner in May.... and there is still a beer in my fridge!

A bottle of JD does make a nice counter top decoration. But a 12 pack of Shiner in May and this is November? It would have lasted 1 night if I were around.

I finished it off over the Thanksgiving Weekend. It was a delicious way to end a great day!

I have 5 kids... I refuse to be intoxicated when my kids are home/around etc. Therefore I limit myself to one beer at a time and only occasionally have even that! It does make it better when I do though.... YUMMMY!

I dont drink period, however I do have to take prescription pain medication for a very messed up lower back that multiple doctors have not been able to identify and correct. The question on the CHL application is kind of broad and asks if you are dependant on drugs or alcohol. I guess that my body is dependant on the medication because if I run out, the pain is almost unbearable and my body begins to go through a withdrawl of the drug. The pain medication doesnt make me "goofy" or cause me to do strange things, and I dont abuse them. I have been on them for over 8 years now and have undergone several major surgeries, procedures, etc. Very close friends of mine, who have known me for 20 + years said that they didnt notice a difference in me and no idea that I was on pain medication. I guess that they expected that I would act like an idiot or play with my food or something? The problem is that if someone was about to get phyical, I would need my pistol to protect my family or myself. Since I cant really run, fight for long periods or definately couldnt take on more than one bad guy at a time, I'm going to need my pistol to even things up, or put them in my favor. I'm sure that there are a lot of people who take medication for pain that just check no on the form and go on. I'm really not sure how to address this issue? Has anyone addressed this before or have an answer for those with pain issues that have to take medications?

Texasbud wrote:I dont drink period, however I do have to take prescription pain medication for a very messed up lower back that multiple doctors have not been able to identify and correct. The question on the CHL application is kind of broad and asks if you are dependant on drugs or alcohol. I guess that my body is dependant on the medication because if I run out, the pain is almost unbearable and my body begins to go through a withdrawl of the drug. The pain medication doesnt make me "goofy" or cause me to do strange things, and I dont abuse them. I have been on them for over 8 years now and have undergone several major surgeries, procedures, etc. Very close friends of mine, who have known me for 20 + years said that they didnt notice a difference in me and no idea that I was on pain medication. I guess that they expected that I would act like an idiot or play with my food or something? The problem is that if someone was about to get phyical, I would need my pistol to protect my family or myself. Since I cant really run, fight for long periods or definately couldnt take on more than one bad guy at a time, I'm going to need my pistol to even things up, or put them in my favor. I'm sure that there are a lot of people who take medication for pain that just check no on the form and go on. I'm really not sure how to address this issue? Has anyone addressed this before or have an answer for those with pain issues that have to take medications?

Welcome to the forum.

The eligibility requirement is that you are not a 'chemically dependent person' or have been not been diagnosed by a physician as chemically dependent (aka addicted) to alcohol or illegal drugs.

Chemically dependent is defined as:

(2) “Chemically dependent person” means a person who frequently or
repeatedly becomes intoxicated by excessive indulgence in alcohol or uses
controlled substances or dangerous drugs so as to acquire a fixed habit and an
involuntary tendency to become intoxicated or use those substances as often
as the opportunity is presented.

If you are currently under a doctors care and taking prescription medication for pain management, then that is not what they are looking for.

Now, with that said, prescription medication can cause you to be legally intoxicated so you have to make sure the prescription that you do not meet the definition while carrying a firearm

"Intoxicated" means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body; or
(B) having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.

I have a very good friend who was in a very bad wreck 40 years ago and has more metal in him than most cars these days. He takes levels of hydrocodone that would make many people loopy, but because the meds are the level he needs to manage the pain, that is all they do and don't affect his abilities. In fact, he is much more level headed and capable of functioning when on his pain meds than he is when he is in pain.

So, I would unless it does affect you in the manner that you would meet intoxicated I would say you are not chemically dependent on meds or alcohol.

I appreciate you clearing this up for me. I noticed that some states specifically states "illegal" drugs on their application. I don't try to see if I can get loopy on pain meds, but I know plenty of folks who take enough to cause real damage to a normal sized man, but the ingredients go to the pain receptors and you wouldn't know that they were taking anything. Thanks again, now I can get my CHL so that I can protect my family.

Its a non issue for me because I don't drink period but I do like to get my copehagen on

The legislature needs to address this issue Half the legal limit to drive would be about right for carry

"Intoxicated" means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body

tommyg wrote:The legislature needs to address this issue Half the legal limit to drive would be about right for carry

Eight seems a little young for concealed carry but I could get on board with lowering the age limit to eighteen for all Texans.

Keith B wrote:If your friend was imparired by his drinking, then he was illegally carrying. Personnally, I may have one beer with a meal while carrying, but that is the limit for me, and that is a rare instance. And that will depend on my personal condition at the time of the consumption. If a person is tired or not feeling up to par, even one beer can potentially impair them and cause them to be illegally carrying.

No, if he was INTOXICATED while he was carrying then he was breaking the law. I'm IMPAIRED when someone smokes a cigarette next to me, because it stings my eyes and dulls my reaction time, but I'm not going to disarm.

The definition of intoxicated in 46.035 is "EXACTLY" the same as for driving. It's not "up to the cop's discretion" and it's not any more vague than it is for driving. It's up to the State to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that you were intoxicated as defined by the law. Same burden as for proving you were DWI. If you won't arm when you go out and have a drink then you should not drive either.

ScottDLS wrote:If you won't arm when you go out and have a drink then you should not drive either.

Not debating law here, but I subscribe to the "avoid the very appearance of evil" approach. I don't drink, but if I did I would not even consider doing so while driving or CCing. But, "Let every man work out his own salvation".