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One thing I learned as a young pup, if you don't know the property owner, don't go wandering on their land after dark. In the country, most folk have no trespassing signs up. If this were the case, then you were trespassing. In either case, I would not have gone up to his house (unless I knew the family) after dark and their lights off. I would have left a note on my own vehicle (and have done so) stating I would return in the morning.
If the property owner had a gun in his hand already, you would have been full of holes before you cleared leather unless you are Quick Draw McGraw (for those my age to understand). So even if you were carrying, drawing probably wouldn't be in your best interest.

A late night trespasser asking if he can defend himself from a homeowner?
I had to double check the calendar to be sure it wasn't 4/1.

kg5ie wrote:Time to put that "non-violent conflict resolution" stuff you talked about in CHL class to the test!

I think the unsung part of this story is that no one is mourning the loss of so much bacon of the hoof.

Unicorn Rancher wrote:A late night trespasser asking if he can defend himself from a homeowner?
I had to double check the calendar to be sure it wasn't 4/1.

From a homeowner not in his home, when he's broken down. Yea life isn't black and white.

Strangely enough we just had jury convict "a homeowner" for just such a thing.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

kg5ie wrote:Time to put that "non-violent conflict resolution" stuff you talked about in CHL class to the test!

I think the unsung part of this story is that no one is mourning the loss of so much bacon of the hoof.

I was wondering if anyone was going to ask about the pork!

If something riles up the dogs and wakes up me, I send out the dogs to say hello whole i stand overwatch with a 30-06. Usally it's a small wild animal that the dogs can handle but if not, that's why I have the '06.

My property is properly posted. If someone doesn't see the signs because they decided to trespass after dark, that's their own doggone fault.

I hope some of you folks never need assistance when you are out in the sticks. Because you just might get the same treatment you are advocating.

bigity wrote:I hope some of you folks never need assistance when you are out in the sticks. Because you just might get the same treatment you are advocating.

So because I understand why the homeowner was guarded when a stranger was on his property after dark in the middle of nowhere I am the bad guy?

killerfly128 wrote:

bigity wrote:I hope some of you folks never need assistance when you are out in the sticks. Because you just might get the same treatment you are advocating.

So because I understand why the homeowner was guarded when a stranger was on his property after dark in the middle of nowhere I am the bad guy?

Not saying you're a bad guy. I am saying: 1) it might not be the best idea to investigate something in the dark (Too many variables); 2) being ready to blast someone because they are on your properety is not necessarily going to cut it in front of a jury.

killerfly128 wrote:

bigity wrote:I hope some of you folks never need assistance when you are out in the sticks. Because you just might get the same treatment you are advocating.

So because I understand why the homeowner was guarded when a stranger was on his property after dark in the middle of nowhere I am the bad guy?

Not necessarily you specifically. Talking more about the 'unleash the hounds!' and sort out the aftermath once harm has been done mentality.

Cedar Park Dad wrote: Legally he is fully justified to defend himself. He has made no criminal action whatsover. Farmer Bob coming out and drawing on the poster would have been the one committing a felony, not him.

So let me get this straight. The poster trespasses at night, and if Farmer Bob draws on the trespasser he is committing a felony?

As someone who lives way out in the sticks, anyone parking in my driveway and approaching my house late at night is going to be greeted with me armed. They may have a valid reason for being there (i.e. hitting a deer or hog or what ever), but just like Farmer Bob, I am going to be extremely cautious and suspicious until their story is verified. Someone just "claiming" they are having car trouble from a distance is not going to cut it.

As others have noted, response time for the sheriff dept can be rather lengthy. I'm not going to just sit inside waiting to see what one or more individuals may be up to.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:Not saying you're a bad guy. I am saying: 1) it might not be the best idea to investigate something in the dark (Too many variables); 2) being ready to blast someone because they are on your properety is not necessarily going to cut it in front of a jury.

1.) While true, it still might be the correct action depending on PD response time. If I call PD because there is someone rooting around in my shed and I know from past experience that it is going to take them an hour plus, I am going out there with a flashlight and a gun. It wouldn't be my first choice of action, but you gotta do what ya gotta do.

2.) The OP stated "I was armed with nothing but a 4" Gerber fixed blade that I had on my belt. My buddy, the driver, was just standing there, arms crossed, with apparently no intent to make it known that we meant no harm." If the body language was there to make me fear from my safety, that is gonna cut it with a grand jury.

Bottom like is this, the OP was in the wrong on several occasions. Farmer Bob wasn't. The OP shouldn't have put himself in several of the positions he was in, Farmer Bob reacted accordingly.

I still haven't got an answer as to if Farmer Bob told them to leave at any point. Any variation of a phrase that suggests they go elsewhere is sufficient to bring Criminal Trespass into play. Had that happened, the OP would have been the bad guy for all intents and purposes.

2.) The OP stated "I was armed with nothing but a 4" Gerber fixed blade that I had on my belt. My buddy, the driver, was just standing there, arms crossed, with apparently no intent to make it known that we meant no harm." If the body language was there to make me fear from my safety, that is gonna cut it with a grand jury.

Maybe, maybe not. Its not something I would want to stake my life on.

Bottom like is this, the OP was in the wrong on several occasions

Agreed. And that is a good part of this thread, thinking about what was done wrong and what could be done right if this happens to us. Unfortunately its not uncommon to break down, and thinking about it could avoid any negative situation.

. Farmer Bob wasn't. The OP shouldn't have put himself in several of the positions he was in, Farmer Bob reacted accordingly.

Tactically we're going to have to agree to disagree. If the OP was indeed one of several bad guys, Farmer Bob is now in the dark with potential hostiles, not all of whom he may know are there.

However, like your argument and farmer Bob, I stepped out into the dark last night myself, as my doggie was going berserk at what I thought was a cat. If it wasn't a cat I was in the same tactically poor position I'm arguing one shouldn't do. So maybe its "do what I say and not what I do."

poppo wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote: Legally he is fully justified to defend himself. He has made no criminal action whatsover. Farmer Bob coming out and drawing on the poster would have been the one committing a felony, not him.

So let me get this straight. The poster trespasses at night, and if Farmer Bob draws on the trespasser he is committing a felony?

As someone who lives way out in the sticks, anyone parking in my driveway and approaching my house late at night is going to be greeted with me armed. They may have a valid reason for being there (i.e. hitting a deer or hog or what ever), but just like Farmer Bob, I am going to be extremely cautious and suspicious until their story is verified. Someone just "claiming" they are having car trouble from a distance is not going to cut it.

As others have noted, response time for the sheriff dept can be rather lengthy. I'm not going to just sit inside waiting to see what one or more individuals may be up to.

I was skimming this thread thinking how to respond when poppo nailed it (again! I like this guy!).

And as for the OP, unless I was somehow stranded in a no-coverage cell area, I wouldn't even consider approaching a dark house in the dead-of-night. And if I *did* consider it, hopefully I would be alert enough to remember that movie (wasn't Leatherface living just outside of Lockhart?).

poppo wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote: Legally he is fully justified to defend himself. He has made no criminal action whatsover. Farmer Bob coming out and drawing on the poster would have been the one committing a felony, not him.

So let me get this straight. The poster trespasses at night, and if Farmer Bob draws on the trespasser he is committing a felony?

As someone who lives way out in the sticks, anyone parking in my driveway and approaching my house late at night is going to be greeted with me armed. They may have a valid reason for being there (i.e. hitting a deer or hog or what ever), but just like Farmer Bob, I am going to be extremely cautious and suspicious until their story is verified. Someone just "claiming" they are having car trouble from a distance is not going to cut it.

As others have noted, response time for the sheriff dept can be rather lengthy. I'm not going to just sit inside waiting to see what one or more individuals may be up to.

And let's face it how matters as much what you do. If you feel you need to knock on the door then you walk up and try and make yourself obvious and holler out when you think someone is up. Not start walking in then take off when the dogs bark. So what if the homeowners are a bit on edge? I put them there by my actions so I do everything I can to make them comfortable and if it's too much then I didn't really need to bother them anyway now did I?