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Interesting. I wonder if this action had anything to do with military installations being on FPCon Bravo.

Taypo wrote:

bigity wrote:I was stationed at GAFB from 96-99 (and still know several people still working there) and there are no active flight lines.

Most likely some new duty sergeant/officer was notified someone saw people with guns near the fence line, and had no personal knowledge of dove hunting or Texas law or anything and overreacted.

Also, as far as I am aware, there has never been an incident of someone attacking the base - so I'm not sure why leaving the base grounds and detaining citizens who are committing no crime is allowed in the first place as a first response.

And yes, the SPs get bored and will pull some stunts from time to time. I got to lay on the ground once when I was working building lockup and set off the alarm accidentally while securing one of the SCIFs. AFTER showing proper ID - heck, I knew the guy (but not well).

I was there briefly in that time period, we may have crossed paths. I was on the Army side of the post - we used to love stealing your golf carts after we'd had a few Gatorades.

We played roller hockey with a couple of Army guys, and of course B team softball (the team where the point was to drink beer and have fun) with some Army folks. I dealt with computers for the 17 TRSS.

DocV wrote:Interesting. I wonder if this action had anything to do with military installations being on FPCon Bravo.

When I was there, we were at ThreatCon Bravo for about 2 years straight. It didn't mean much. These days it might be different.

bigity wrote:

DocV wrote:Interesting. I wonder if this action had anything to do with military installations being on FPCon Bravo.

When I was there, we were at ThreatCon Bravo for about 2 years straight. It didn't mean much. These days it might be different.

Even so, regardless of what FP condition the base is operating under....they have no reason to be detaining dove hunters...hunting on private property outside the base perimeter. If security wants them checked out, they should call the local LE agency who has jurisdiction to handle it...and they certainly overstepped the boundaries of common sense making them lay down on asphalt in San Angelo at this time of the year even if they DID have jurisdiction.

bigity wrote:

Taypo wrote:

bigity wrote:I was stationed at GAFB from 96-99 (and still know several people still working there) and there are no active flight lines.

Most likely some new duty sergeant/officer was notified someone saw people with guns near the fence line, and had no personal knowledge of dove hunting or Texas law or anything and overreacted.

Also, as far as I am aware, there has never been an incident of someone attacking the base - so I'm not sure why leaving the base grounds and detaining citizens who are committing no crime is allowed in the first place as a first response.

And yes, the SPs get bored and will pull some stunts from time to time. I got to lay on the ground once when I was working building lockup and set off the alarm accidentally while securing one of the SCIFs. AFTER showing proper ID - heck, I knew the guy (but not well).

I was there briefly in that time period, we may have crossed paths. I was on the Army side of the post - we used to love stealing your golf carts after we'd had a few Gatorades.

We played roller hockey with a couple of Army guys, and of course B team softball (the team where the point was to drink beer and have fun) with some Army folks. I dealt with computers for the 17 TRSS.

If you played roller hockey in town in '96, we probably met. I typically played goal for an Army group a couple times a week. Back in those days, I also had a tendency to get into a fight by the second period too.

While I disagree with the SPs actions, I would first point out that could possibly have had legal jurisdiction and a responsibility to take action. A report of armed personnel near a fence line to the base justifies some response. And their jurisdiction extends quite a bit outside the fence line when it is used to stop a potential threat to national security (possible armed invasion of the base).

I think there will be (or already have been) quite a few discussions between the SPs involved and their superiors, from the squad leaders on up to the base commander. I would even bet the base commander has been on the phone a few times higher up. As was pointed out, the higher ups hate anything that makes the Air Force look bad.

May be in the replies somewhere, but I haven't had the chance to read them all.

The only action that will carry any weight is to contact the Commanding Officer no matter the rank.
Demand to see him or her face to face and lay out what happened. I'm sure the report they received did not
detail the situation from the hunter's point of view. Base police are often private security and mostly inept.
At least those that I have seen in action.

The punnishment for those involved should as in my boot camp days - ALL in the unit even if not involved be
punished equally. This ensures this type of behavior doesn't happen again. Peers will not tolerate this when
their hide is also on the line.

Security of sensitive material has nothing to do with ruthlessness of security personel.
As long as they don't breech the fence, no law or rule is broken. PERIOD!

ssnstump wrote:May be in the replies somewhere, but I haven't had the chance to read them all.

The only action that will carry any weight is to contact the Commanding Officer no matter the rank.
Demand to see him or her face to face and lay out what happened. I'm sure the report they received did not
detail the situation from the hunter's point of view. Base police are often private security and mostly inept.
At least those that I have seen in action.

The punnishment for those involved should as in my boot camp days - ALL in the unit even if not involved be
punished equally. This ensures this type of behavior doesn't happen again. Peers will not tolerate this when
their hide is also on the line.

Security of sensitive material has nothing to do with ruthlessness of security personel.
As long as they don't breech the fence, no law or rule is broken. PERIOD!

Sorry, but it doesn't work that way anymore. I'm a 21-year veteran of the USAF, and "retired" from active service 5 years ago, and I have two kids in the USAF. There are no more "code reds" or "blanket parties", so punishing everyone for the transgressions of a few doesn't make any difference. I'm certain that there was a bit of a stink over this incident, and I'm also certain that it's been handled.

K.Mooneyham wrote:

ssnstump wrote:May be in the replies somewhere, but I haven't had the chance to read them all.

The only action that will carry any weight is to contact the Commanding Officer no matter the rank.
Demand to see him or her face to face and lay out what happened. I'm sure the report they received did not
detail the situation from the hunter's point of view. Base police are often private security and mostly inept.
At least those that I have seen in action.

The punnishment for those involved should as in my boot camp days - ALL in the unit even if not involved be
punished equally. This ensures this type of behavior doesn't happen again. Peers will not tolerate this when
their hide is also on the line.

Security of sensitive material has nothing to do with ruthlessness of security personel.
As long as they don't breech the fence, no law or rule is broken. PERIOD!

Sorry, but it doesn't work that way anymore. I'm a 21-year veteran of the USAF, and "retired" from active service 5 years ago, and I have two kids in the USAF. There are no more "code reds" or "blanket parties", so punishing everyone for the transgressions of a few doesn't make any difference. I'm certain that there was a bit of a stink over this incident, and I'm also certain that it's been handled.