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steveincowtown wrote:For all those that agree with the school implementing this rule, I would submit that you are unintentionally yielding to the idea the children are the collective responsibility of government and society and that they do not belong to their parents.

Parents need to be making these decisions, not schools.

Parents do make those decisions. I've seen parents change/set policies hundreds of times. It's simply a matter of getting enough parents behind the issue.
If you want your daughter to wear a strapless dress get enough parents together who believe as you do and you will get what you want.
In this case the majority of the parents over time have expressed their will for a certain dress standard which the district has adopted.

jmra wrote:

steveincowtown wrote:For all those that agree with the school implementing this rule, I would submit that you are unintentionally yielding to the idea the children are the collective responsibility of government and society and that they do not belong to their parents.

Parents need to be making these decisions, not schools.

Parents do make those decisions. I've seen parents change/set policies hundreds of times. It's simply a matter of getting enough parents behind the issue.
If you want your daughter to wear a strapless dress get enough parents together who believe as you do and you will get what you want.
In this case the majority of the parents over time have expressed their will for a certain dress standard which the district has adopted.

What you are saying is, by definition, collectivism. If this is what you believe, I certainly have no problem with it, it is just not what I happen to believe.

Collectivist orientations stress the importance of cohesion within social groups (such as an "in-group", in what specific context it is defined) and in some cases, the priority of group goals over individual goals.

I don't need the government, or other parents, telling me what is or isn't right.

steveincowtown wrote:

jmra wrote:

steveincowtown wrote:For all those that agree with the school implementing this rule, I would submit that you are unintentionally yielding to the idea the children are the collective responsibility of government and society and that they do not belong to their parents.

Parents need to be making these decisions, not schools.

Parents do make those decisions. I've seen parents change/set policies hundreds of times. It's simply a matter of getting enough parents behind the issue.
If you want your daughter to wear a strapless dress get enough parents together who believe as you do and you will get what you want.
In this case the majority of the parents over time have expressed their will for a certain dress standard which the district has adopted.

What you are saying is, by definition, collectivism. If this is what you believe, I certainly have no problem with it, it is just not what I happen to believe.

Collectivist orientations stress the importance of cohesion within social groups (such as an "in-group", in what specific context it is defined) and in some cases, the priority of group goals over individual goals.

I don't need the government, or other parents, telling me what is or isn't right.

It's not a matter of what I believe, it's a matter of "do I choose to participate". I assume attendance at the dance is not mandatory. If you don't agree with the rules and are not willing to fight to change them, then dont participate.
This forum has guidelines and rules that you may not agree with, but if you choose to participate you abide by the rules.

If your work place is properly posted (even though you may believe it is wrong to do so) you can choose to work there unarmed or you can choose to work somewhere else.

Like you, I will decide what I believe to be right or wrong for my kids. In cases where I believe the rules are not suited to my beliefs I will take what I believe to be the appropriate measures. This means that there will be things that other kids participate in that they will not. In this particular case, I would be much more comfortable with my young teenage son attending a dance where the rules err on the side of caution than I would be if the rules were made to fit the most liberal parent's desires. On the flip side, if the girls were required to wear turtle necks I probably wouldn't have anything to worry about because my son would not want to go anyway.

Bottom line, society will always have rules. Some we will agree with others we will not. We can either work to change those we don't agree with or we can isolate ourselves from those parts of society. I don't believe either decision is a wrong one.

Strapless dresses on middle school girls is not ok by me. Our local ISD requires three fingers of sleeve on girls tops (and shorts that reach their fingertips). For the boys it's less about a problem with covering up sufficiently and more about rules for being neat and clean. If a girl has a sleeveless dress, she'll need to wear some sort of top over it to meet the dress code. I'm perfectly ok with this. I would not want my 13/14/15 y.o. daughter to be peer-pressured towards sexualization of her attire just to meet some child-decided social code. Children don't get to make that decision in a vacuum and I get to help set minimum standards for those parents that forget they are parents. The ISD decides the code, which hopefully reflects the preferences of the local parents. That's the way it should be. I suppose since I live in the ISD, the rules should come close to resembling my beliefs/preferences. If they don't I can try to change the rules or choose not to participate.

Schools should not be deciding what Lisa wears to Maria's birthday party at Maria 's house. That is up to Lisa and her parents, and what Maria's parents think is appropriate in their home.

School boards and administration do have the power to decide what is appropriate at school and at school sponsored events. If people dont like those decisions they can protest. They can elect a new
school board, if enough people agree.

While this prom "dress" wasn't strapless, I know that when first I heard of the Reading School policy controversy, this is what came to mind:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/1 ... 01311.html
A strapless dress with a properly constructed bodice is no more revealing or immodest than a similar model with spaghetti straps, perhaps less so, as the construction of the garment doesn't depend on a few threads on a strap for support. This fact was pointed out to me by my wife, who when still my virginal fiancé, wore a strapless white gown to our Catholic wedding mass 40 years ago.
Man, she was then, and still is, a knockout!

This is a strapless dress.

If you think it is slutty, trashy or in any other way promiscuous or excessively reveailing, they you are a hopeless sex fiend and the problem is with YOU, not the lady wearing the dress.

Hear, hear! Y'all better not ever go to the belly dance show at Cafe Byblos on Richmond Ave or you'll be leaving in an ambulance.

android wrote:This is a strapless dress.

If you think it is slutty, trashy or in any other way promiscuous or excessively reveailing, they you are a hopeless sex fiend and the problem is with YOU, not the lady wearing the dress.

[ Image ]

She's not 13 either.

jmra wrote:

android wrote:This is a strapless dress.

If you think it is slutty, trashy or in any other way promiscuous or excessively reveailing, they you are a hopeless sex fiend and the problem is with YOU, not the lady wearing the dress.

[ Image ]

She's not 13 either.

This would be my point....it is a beautiful dress Kate Is wearing. The dress is lovely, graceful, an amazing dress for a beautiful lady. Kate, however, is a grown women and I doubt she would be doing the excessive dancing that the ladies at the prom will be. So unless the are doing the waltz at the prom....