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Hos wrote: If they follow me then I'll take them on in my stall turned bunker with little fear of innocents being hit with crossfire.

Drywall hollow walls likely separate the restroom from the other rooms in the building.

As was shown on http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; any defensive pistol round will go through at least six hollow drywall walls (12 or more layers of 5/8" drywall), and 9mm rounds even went through 8 layers of 3/4" pine plywood. Even a .22LR fired from a pistol went through 6 layers of drywall and four layers of 3/4" plywood.

You still sure you can take on the BGs in the restroom without fear of innocents being hit with crossfire? Remind me where you dine, so I can go somewhere else.

Fangs wrote:Hopefully CHLer #2 would take a second to see where CHLer #1 was shooting at and notice guys wearing ski masks / bandanas with guns / bags... Is there any actual case of a CHLer being shot by an off-duty LEO or other CHLer in the above mentioned scenario?

That is a situation where we display our CHL badge, correct?

mr.72 wrote:

Hos wrote: If they follow me then I'll take them on in my stall turned bunker with little fear of innocents being hit with crossfire.

Drywall hollow walls likely separate the restroom from the other rooms in the building.

As was shown on http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; any defensive pistol round will go through at least six hollow drywall walls (12 or more layers of 5/8" drywall), and 9mm rounds even went through 8 layers of 3/4" pine plywood. Even a .22LR fired from a pistol went through 6 layers of drywall and four layers of 3/4" plywood.

You still sure you can take on the BGs in the restroom without fear of innocents being hit with crossfire? Remind me where you dine, so I can go somewhere else.

Hmm, no worries, I'll just be shooting down from my stall-turned-bunker since i'd be standing on the toilet!

In all seriousness, IDK what I'd do. I probably would not ever leave my family's side for them to face that trauma without me.

Hmm, wonder if you can text msg 911 with the address? Doubt it but it might help in limited scenerios.

Hos wrote: Wonder if BG's would try to do this at a BBQ joint as opposed to a fancy Asian restaurant?

LOL...good point. BBQ=Gun Toting Rednecks

Actually this is an interesting scenario and something to think about. I'd proffer other scenarios in the future might be good for discussion. Its an easy situation if you're walking in a field and Osama bin Laden pops up exactly 15 yds away with a knife, but how often do we think about the more complex situations?

A movie theater
Workplace situation
Church situation (have thought about that one quite a bit actually)
What if a pit bull attacks your dog while walking said domestic canine
What if a pit bull is attacking a child

etc. etc.

That is a situation where we display our CHL badge, correct?

Finally, a solution that works. Just as laughing juries don't convict, maybe laughing suspects won't open fire.

A couple of things cross my mind about this...

If you listen to the reporter, employees inside the restaurant ran into the freezer and dialed 911 as the gun men entered the building.. Then the reporter says the event lasted 5 minutes. FIVE FULL MINUTES! This proves beyond a doubt that when seconds count, the cops are minutes away. I'm not knocking the police, they have a very tough job to do and are really spread thin here in Houston. However, the fact remains-five full minutes this encounter went on, and then the perps had time to leave the building, and still no cops around.

One other thing I wanted everyone to give thought to... Of those 40-50 people no one could identify the race of the suspects?
If anyone reading this believes that, let me shake you and wake you up to reality. Somebody, or many somebody's inside that restaurant know what the perpetrators race is. Is it just a Houston thing where the news REFUSES to identify the race of criminals? Why is this? If a criminal is on the loose, I think the more relevant information about that person(s) given to the public, the better chance of catching these guys. But yet, Houston news stations, and The Houston Crapicle (Chronicle) REFUSE to tell you this information. Are they afraid they will get sued for discrimination or what? I don't get it.

In the early 1960's the U.S. news media voluntarily stopped identifying suspects by race out of fear of potential libel litigation (nonsense, truth is an absolute defense to libel) and in the interest of social and political correctness (more nonsense, there is no such thing as correctness, only competing special interests). Since that time, the American people have not had the facts of the matter before them, and as a consequence have become almost wholly uninformed as to the racial makeup of the criminal element. Uninformed and ignorant voters make poor personal and public choices, as we recently witnessed in the presidential election.

Kawabuggy wrote:A couple of things cross my mind about this...

If you listen to the reporter, employees inside the restaurant ran into the freezer and dialed 911 as the gun men entered the building.. Then the reporter says the event lasted 5 minutes. FIVE FULL MINUTES! This proves beyond a doubt that when seconds count, the cops are minutes away. I'm not knocking the police, they have a very tough job to do and are really spread thin here in Houston. However, the fact remains-five full minutes this encounter went on, and then the perps had time to leave the building, and still no cops around.

One other thing I wanted everyone to give thought to... Of those 40-50 people no one could identify the race of the suspects?
If anyone reading this believes that, let me shake you and wake you up to reality. Somebody, or many somebody's inside that restaurant know what the perpetrators race is. Is it just a Houston thing where the news REFUSES to identify the race of criminals? Why is this? If a criminal is on the loose, I think the more relevant information about that person(s) given to the public, the better chance of catching these guys. But yet, Houston news stations, and The Houston Crapicle (Chronicle) REFUSE to tell you this information. Are they afraid they will get sued for discrimination or what? I don't get it.

I don't believe that knowing the race would be all that helpful. If there were a good description maybe, but even that without a sketch or photo is pretty useless. I suppose it might make some people feel better when they can claim that "It was one of those _____________ (fill in the blank with a favorite racial epithet ) that did it."

Liberty wrote:

Kawabuggy wrote:A couple of things cross my mind about this...

If you listen to the reporter, employees inside the restaurant ran into the freezer and dialed 911 as the gun men entered the building.. Then the reporter says the event lasted 5 minutes. FIVE FULL MINUTES! This proves beyond a doubt that when seconds count, the cops are minutes away. I'm not knocking the police, they have a very tough job to do and are really spread thin here in Houston. However, the fact remains-five full minutes this encounter went on, and then the perps had time to leave the building, and still no cops around.

One other thing I wanted everyone to give thought to... Of those 40-50 people no one could identify the race of the suspects?
If anyone reading this believes that, let me shake you and wake you up to reality. Somebody, or many somebody's inside that restaurant know what the perpetrators race is. Is it just a Houston thing where the news REFUSES to identify the race of criminals? Why is this? If a criminal is on the loose, I think the more relevant information about that person(s) given to the public, the better chance of catching these guys. But yet, Houston news stations, and The Houston Crapicle (Chronicle) REFUSE to tell you this information. Are they afraid they will get sued for discrimination or what? I don't get it.

I don't believe that knowing the race would be all that helpful. If there were a good description maybe, but even that without a sketch or photo is pretty useless. I suppose it might make some people feel better when they can claim that "It was one of those _____________ (fill in the blank with a favorite racial epithet ) that did it."

You may be right, knowing the perp's race would not be an identifier. OTOH, knowing the perp's race would tell you who Did Not do the foul deed.

Oldgringo wrote:
You may be right, knowing the perp's race would not be an identifier. OTOH, knowing the perp's race would tell you who Did Not do the foul deed.

How would that be useful to the public? Assuming the guys were Houston residents there are 4 Million people that didn't do it. The robbers were wearing hoodies and bandanas, their ethnicity may not have been obvious and could have been contridictory from the witnesses.

Liberty wrote:

Oldgringo wrote:
You may be right, knowing the perp's race would not be an identifier. OTOH, knowing the perp's race would tell you who Did Not do the foul deed.

How would that be useful to the public? Assuming the guys were Houston residents there are 4 Million people that didn't do it. The robbers were wearing hoodies and bandanas, their ethnicity may not have been obvious and could have been contridictory from the witnesses.

Whatever.

If we are leaving out information that doesn't help anyway, why not leave out the hoody part? Millions of young people wear hoodies. We all know the reason they won't mention race has nothing to do with whether or not it is useful information.

They should also leave out whether it's a man or a woman. That's even less of a distinction than skin color.

They should leave out species also. What's next...maybe leave out the perp had one leg and a hook for a hand? We sure don't want to offend one legged hooked handed people.