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AndyC wrote:Placement and sufficient penetration, yep

Only thing that matters is knockdown power. No pea shooters for me.

AndyC wrote:

mojo84 wrote:Only thing that matters is knockdown power.

There's no such thing.

That's simply and patently untrue, Andy.

A 5-ton wrecking ball swung from a 150-foot crane gathers a significant amount of kinetic energy as it descends. It has plenty of knockdown power.

.45 and a 5 ton cannonball are the same. Nothing compares. Haven't you seen the guys fly backwards through windows and out doors from getting shot with 45 Colt in the westerns?

Anything less than a .45 isn't worth carrying. They'll only make the bad guy madder.

If you shoot a guy in the hand with a .45, it'll rip his whole arm off!

It must be true because I heard a Marine say that to Eugene Sledge in The Pacific miniseries.

Uh-oh. I feel it coming on---a lengthy discussion by wannabe-physicists on the subjects of ballistics and kinetic energy.

Might have already been said, but I am surprised he did not keel over dead as soon as store owner pointed the 45 at him.

Good job

I don't want to start a caliber war but I wonder how my EDC Sig P239 in .357 Sig compares to a .45 round in knockdown power? I do own a 1911 and it's one of my favorite shooters, dear wife enjoys it as well

majorr wrote:I've worked in the prison system for 20+ years now. VERY often I see offenders with scars from bullets wounds. When asked about the scars I hear replies like "yep, got me with a 9", "3 times with a 380 and I'm still here", or "hit with a 40 but I'm tough". I have rarely spoken to an offender who has scars from a 45. Wonder why?

I have no research to back it up and am totally going out on a limb, but my uneducated guess based solely on my very limited local exposure would include several assumptions (we all know what happens when we assume):
1. Most (not all) of these guys were shot by another BG or LEO.
2. Most of the departments I'm familiar with carry either .40 or 9mm.
3. Not a lot of 1911s (or other .45 models) floating around illegally on the streets compared to other calibers. Most 1911 owners I know (myself included) invest in a safe. The only firearm not in the safe is a much less expensive 9mm "drawer gun".
So, my very unscientific conclusion is that the guys you encountered were much less likely to be shot with a .45 than the other calibers listed. Of course I could be completely and totally wrong.

A lot of the ammo that's out on the street is ball ammo. 9mm FMJ isn't wonderfully effective.

Liberty wrote:A lot of the ammo that's out on the street is ball ammo. 9mm FMJ isn't wonderfully effective.

True. I doubt gangbangers are paying a buck+ a round for self defense ammo.