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orc4hire wrote:Just finished my CHL Renewal course at DFW Gun Range today (well, technically yesterday now). Overall a good experience, but not without a few glitches.

The class was scheduled to start at 9am, but everyone was told to show up early to log in and pay. Unfortunately people were told different times to show up; some 8:30, some 8:45. And they didn't actually open the doors until about 8:55. Not a big deal, but I've got a teething 7-month old at home and my total sleep for the past couple nights doesn't add up to eight hours put together; I could have used that extra fifteen minutes of sleep.

With all due respect...your sleep is your concern. You have no idea when people other than yourself were told to be there. You only know what people TOLD you they were told...........

The doors SHOULD have been open no later than 8:45, and that will be addressed this week, rest assured.

What do you mean it was overbooked? How many were a proper booking? How do you know? DO you know that one person signed up themself and brought a second person without telling us? We did allow that person in as customer service.

As far as the person who was signed up for the intial class rather than the renewal, well, we just don't know whose fault that is do we? I have had students in my initial class, and after telling the class several times that we are an INITIAL class, for people who have never had a CHL before, finally tell me they are actually renewing their license. All we can do is sign them up on the list they ask to be on.

I will check the website, and if it indicates that class ends at 1PM I will have it changed. It is SELDOM we can finish before 2PM. There is just too much to do.

As the training director at the DFW Range, I appreciate your constructive comments.

txinvestigator wrote:With all due respect...your sleep is your concern.

That's some friendly customer service right there, by golly!

orc4hire wrote:

txinvestigator wrote: With all due respect...your sleep is your concern. You have no idea when people other than yourself were told to be there. You only know what people TOLD you they were told...........

I never said my sleep was anyone's concern but my own. I DID strongly imply that I would have preferred to get a little more sleep rather than stand around outside the building waiting. Yes, as regards what other people were told I only have their word for it. As to what the DFW Gun Range employee told me personally, though, I have the evidence of my own ears when he told me 8:30. I queried, "8:30?" to confirm and he seconded, "8:30."

What do you mean it was overbooked? How many were a proper booking? How do you know?

I mean that the instructor SAID the class was overbooked. That there were only supposed to be 15 people, but there were 18. I assume that Mr. Elliott would have some knowledge of these things and took his word for it.

DO you know that one person signed up themself and brought a second person without telling us? We did allow that person in as customer service.

Well, okay, but that doesn't alter the impact on the other students or the flow of the class. Doesn't matter whose fault it is, it's everyone's problem.

As far as the person who was signed up for the intial class rather than the renewal, well, we just don't know whose fault that is do we?

I got the impression that his name was just on the wrong list; he definitely knew that he was supposed to be in the renewal group. Where the mixup there was, though, I cannot say for certain.

I'm not going to watch you make negative comments about my business without responding. You made the statements about overbooking without any evidence. Had you stated your evidence, I would have responded differently.

Bill, (Mr Elliott) is a contract instructor and not an employee. He does not have any control of the sign-up process or have any input into it. We TRY to limit the class size to 15.

Regarding the doors being open; students should be allowed in no later than 8:45 AM. This allows the sign in proces to be complete by 9am so class can start on time. I am going to have a meeting this week with the employees about Saturday mornings. Your post here is going to be the reason for that meeting.

We have learned from expereince that SOME, (not all, but always some) people will arrive exactly when they believe class starts. Thats why we are suppose to tell everyone to be there between 8:30 and 8:45.

I do aplogize that you didn't get in earlier.

It is my experience that some people don't listen well when given instructions or asked for information. It is very possible that the person who was signed up for the wrong class was inadvertenly placed on the wrong list by an employee; however, it is also ppossible that he gave us wrong information at the time he signed up. THis too, will be a topic of my meeting.

Your points will help me manage the classes and make them a better experience for the students. But since you posted your comments in public, I feel compelled to point out a few things from OUR point of view.

I just had a conversation with the initial CHL instructor from Saturday, who just happens to be my father.

A few things cleared up, but I have a specific question for orc4hire, You were in the renewal class and you had 1 employee who signed in your group. Can you describe that process, your experience in it, and your observations. I believe I have another issue to deal with, but the POV of someone actually in line would be helpful.

orc4hire wrote:

txinvestigator wrote:I just had a conversation with the initial CHL instructor from Saturday, who just happens to be my father.

A few things cleared up, but I have a specific question for orc4hire, You were in the renewal class and you had 1 employee who signed in your group. Can you describe that process, your experience in it, and your observations. I believe I have another issue to deal with, but the POV of someone actually in line would be helpful.

The renewal line did seem to be taking longer than the line for the initial class, but I wasn't paying that much attention to the other line, so I can't state that conclusively. Hmm. I was only the fourth person back in line, so I didn't see the _whole_ process, but here's what I've got.

There was a bit of back and forth between the two sign-in lines, trying to find the person who was on the wrong list. Other than that, checking people off the list seemed to go smoothly enough. (I seem to recall one issue of a person's name being not quite right on the list, but that was quickly straightened out, and I may have that wrong.) The guy handling the renewal line was still ringing up the person in front of me when someone came down from the other end of the counter to check me in and we went down to another register to handle the payment. One thing that stands out is that every person in front of me questioned the payment, saying that they'd already paid. In most cases, of course, they hadn't -- they'd just given their credit card number to hold their place in the class -- but one guy actually had a receipt (though the person doing the check-in didn't look at it) and may really have paid in advance. That all took an extra minute or two per person to straighten out.

Does that cover what you're looking for?

That helps, thanks. The moving cars issue is a crock, in my opinion. We don't have any parking to begin with due to the area fenced off for construction. The owner thinks customers coming in to shoot will not stop if the parking area right by the door is full. Regardless, with parking the way it is I am not going to have them make people move who have already parked.

BTW, I checked the security video, and they let people in at 08:43:27. ;)

orc4hire wrote:

txinvestigator wrote: BTW, I checked the security video, and they let people in at 08:43:27. ;)

Hmm. That's the timestamp, but you're sure it matches the time in the outside world? The last time I checked the time it was 8:41 and it was several minutes after that when the doors were opened. It may have been as early as 8:50, but I'd have a hard time believing anything earlier than that.

(And I know my time is accurate; it's from my cell phone, which gets its timestamp from Sprint PCS and it matches the time on my computer, which is checked nightly against four different atomic clocks.)

Even accepting 8:43, though, that's still a long ways from the 8:30 I was told. That, I admit, is more of an issue of me being told the wrong time than the doors opening late. Come to think of it, when that guy asked for my credit card info I don't think he ever said _why_ he needed it. I assumed it was just to hold my place in the class, and confirmed that with him. It's been more than a week now, so I can't be 100% certain that's how the conversation went, but judging from how many people at check-in thought they'd already paid, well, it seems like there's a failure to communicate somewhere. Something to look into, if you haven't already.

Yes, I am sure. It matches my watch, and what my father, who was teaching the initial class, told me.

Even if they opened the doors at 8:30, class does not start until 9. We tell everyone to be there early because the check-in takes time, and to try to get everyone there by 9.

When people reserve a spot we are suppose to tell them several things; to bring a pen and paper, to have their gun and at least 50 rounds of ammo, their Texas DL or ID card, and the renewal packet if they have it We also get a phone number and ask for a credit card number to hold their spot. We are SUPPOSE to tell the person that we are not billing the card then, that we are just holding their spot, and if they want to pay with that card they need to bring it. We are then to tell the person that if they can't make it we would like 24 hours notice.

We have a new guy on the counter, and I bet a little training with him wll insure he gets it down right.

Thanks for the input.

orc4hire wrote:Even with giving up a round on the 3 yard line and shooting one extra at the 15 I still made a perfect score.

Congrads! Perfect score is what I'm going for next renewal