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This was sent to me with the notation that the Swiss have the lowest crime rate in the world. Check it out.

Of particular relevance are the bumper stickers inside Mr Heim's gun locker: "Fight Crime. Shoot back"; "Punish criminals not gun owners"; and best of all "Where have gun laws reduced crime?"

The keys here are two or three:

1. Government needs every citizen to be involved in national defense, trusts them to be involved and under arms in that defense, and trains them to be there on the front lines.

2. Keeping and bearing arms is fundamental for every household.

3. Every single citizen is intimately aware of their responsibility for defending their homeland and themselves.

As a side issue, didn't Switzerland just pass a "no more mosques" law?

Think about it! They probably have no misunderstanding of their place as a Christian nation since they are the source of the Vatican's Swiss Guard detachment, though they probably don't consider themselves a Catholic nation and have substantial populations, per capita, of Prostestants and atheists. Muslims aren't being given any preferential treatment.

http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=6nf1OgV449g" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In a sense they are quite similar to Israel in the way they approach guns in the household. Believe it or not they are currently fighting a virulent anti-gun lobby in their own country.

Oldgringo wrote:Think about it! They probably have no misunderstanding of their place as a Christian nation since they are the source of the Vatican's Swiss Guard detachment, though they probably don't consider themselves a Catholic nation and have substantial populations, per capita, of Prostestants and atheists. Muslims aren't being given any preferential treatment.

To the contrary, Muslims are being singled out: the new law doesn't say anything about "no new church steeples", it says "no new minarets".

The main reason Switzerland hasn't had a problem with terrorist attacks is that they haven't stuck their nose into other countries' business.

Switzerland's famous resistance to invasion is three-fold:

1. They are committed to political neutrality and open trade: "Commerce with all, alliance with none", as Jefferson said (it's a shame we didn't stick with that plan).
2. They are notoriously well armed, with a societal commitment to not just militia service, but voluntary participation in long-range shooting.
3. They are land-locked, with geography of little military importance, and no natural resources that aren't available elsewhere.

That last point shouldn't be downplayed: there's really nothing to be gained by invading Switzerland. But at the same time, it would be a mistake to overlook the importance of the first two.

chabouk wrote:To the contrary, Muslims are being singled out: the new law doesn't say anything about "no new church steeples", it says "no new minarets".

Ah, but the Christians are also restrained from building new minarets.

The Muslims are not being singled out, only a single architectural feature is being prohibited. They are still allowed to build mosques, still allowed to have the 5-times daily call to prayer, still allowed to practice their religion. Do they really need watch towers (that's what minarets REALLY are, after all) in Switzerland?

Mithras61 wrote:

chabouk wrote:To the contrary, Muslims are being singled out: the new law doesn't say anything about "no new church steeples", it says "no new minarets".

Ah, but the Christians are also restrained from building new minarets.

The Muslims are not being singled out, only a single architectural feature is being prohibited. They are still allowed to build mosques, still allowed to have the 5-times daily call to prayer, still allowed to practice their religion. Do they really need watch towers (that's what minarets REALLY are, after all) in Switzerland?

Minarets are very obtrusive and are intended to be. They normally have a guy with strong lungs or a loudspeaker (or both) that is tasked with waking you up, because as the Muslims like to say, "Prayer is better than sleep". This does not work well when you have neighbors that have no religious obligation to get up 5 times a day. I don't blame any country for restricting them. They are noise pollution.

Interesting utube post Oldgringo, thanks! I wasn't aware that after serving in the military, the military GAVE their issue rifles to them when they exited the military. What a concept! The army giving a person who's leaving the military, the rifle that was issued to them.

Oldgringo wrote:
The keys here are two or three:

1. Government needs every citizen to be involved in national defense, trusts them to be involved and under arms in that defense, and trains them to be there on the front lines.

2. Keeping and bearing arms is fundamental for every household.

3. Every single citizen is intimately aware of their responsibility for defending their homeland and themselves.

I have long believed that the U.S. should have a similar stance as far as maintaining an organized citizen's militia. A militia is not a threat to the government, it is the government's greatest defender in a time of attack. (I know, try telling that to Washington). Every household should have a battle rifle and 30 rounds of ammo as a standard. Let the government decide on a standard rifle, work with a manufacturer to produce the rifle at a set price, and offer tax incentives for each head of household which keeps and maintains that rifle as well as participates in regular training, similar to the Army Reserves. Of course, citizens can maintain as many guns in addition to the government standard as they like. I don't know, it just seems that something along those lines would give us a much more secure country.

Purplehood wrote:In a sense they are quite similar to Israel in the way they approach guns in the household. Believe it or not they are currently fighting a virulent anti-gun lobby in their own country.

Yes they are, as the EU labors to wipe out the last vestiges of gun rights in any of it's member nations. Note that Switzerland froze its EU membership application because of Swiss voter resistance to the idea. I would be willing to bet that Swiss anti-gunners also support Switzerland's entry into the EU

The contrast between the USA and Switzerland is almost comical. I have a co-worker (I work for the biggest Offshore Drilling Company in the world) who is Swiss. If he is any indication of the typical Swiss citizen, than they must be a nation of extreme Liberals. However, he appears to be totally at ease with the idea of households having Assault Rifles at hand as a civil requirement (and I mean real AR's). This is all due to how the country was developed.
On the other hand, the US has gradually become more rule-bound and seems to be doing exactly what the Roman Empire did to succumb to barbarians. As more and more citizens in the US become able to enjoy luxuries and leisure, they want the state to handle all their security. In the process they forget that security begins with the citizenry itself, leaving it to the professional warrior-class and the governmental security apparatus.
Even the poor and uneducated of the US now find themselves getting largesse from a Socialist government and enjoying their own newly found sense of empowerment, paying for it with their votes in order not to slide back to where they were at before welfare, earned-income credits and taxing the people that actually work even more.

Purplehood wrote:The contrast between the USA and Switzerland is almost comical. I have a co-worker (I work for the biggest Offshore Drilling Company in the world) who is Swiss. If he is any indication of the typical Swiss citizen, than they must be a nation of extreme Liberals. However, he appears to be totally at ease with the idea of households having Assault Rifles at hand as a civil requirement (and I mean real AR's). This is all due to how the country was developed.
On the other hand, the US has gradually become more rule-bound and seems to be doing exactly what the Roman Empire did to succumb to barbarians. As more and more citizens in the US become able to enjoy luxuries and leisure, they want the state to handle all their security. In the process they forget that security begins with the citizenry itself, leaving it to the professional warrior-class and the governmental security apparatus.
Even the poor and uneducated of the US now find themselves getting largesse from a Socialist government and enjoying their own newly found sense of empowerment, paying for it with their votes in order not to slide back to where they were at before welfare, earned-income credits and taxing the people that actually work even more.

I wrote a blog echoing these thoughts years ago.... glad somebody else thinks the same way

MadMonkey wrote:

Purplehood wrote:The contrast between the USA and Switzerland is almost comical. I have a co-worker (I work for the biggest Offshore Drilling Company in the world) who is Swiss. If he is any indication of the typical Swiss citizen, than they must be a nation of extreme Liberals. However, he appears to be totally at ease with the idea of households having Assault Rifles at hand as a civil requirement (and I mean real AR's). This is all due to how the country was developed.
On the other hand, the US has gradually become more rule-bound and seems to be doing exactly what the Roman Empire did to succumb to barbarians. As more and more citizens in the US become able to enjoy luxuries and leisure, they want the state to handle all their security. In the process they forget that security begins with the citizenry itself, leaving it to the professional warrior-class and the governmental security apparatus.
Even the poor and uneducated of the US now find themselves getting largesse from a Socialist government and enjoying their own newly found sense of empowerment, paying for it with their votes in order not to slide back to where they were at before welfare, earned-income credits and taxing the people that actually work even more.

I wrote a blog echoing these thoughts years ago.... glad somebody else thinks the same way

Regarding the Swiss citizenry or my anti-Socialist and eroding-the-fabric-of-society rant?

I particularly enjoyed the anti-socialist part. Btw, what is this largest offshore drilling company in the world that you speak of Purple?

joe817 wrote:Interesting utube post Oldgringo, thanks! I wasn't aware that after serving in the military, the military GAVE their issue rifles to them when they exited the military. What a concept! The army giving a person who's leaving the military, the rifle that was issued to them.

And they probably wouldn't let you say that you didn't want it. I have been told that it is required of every Swiss male over 18 to have his military rifle in his house.

There's something to be said for that W.B.

Purplehood wrote:

MadMonkey wrote:

Purplehood wrote:The contrast between the USA and Switzerland is almost comical. I have a co-worker (I work for the biggest Offshore Drilling Company in the world) who is Swiss. If he is any indication of the typical Swiss citizen, than they must be a nation of extreme Liberals. However, he appears to be totally at ease with the idea of households having Assault Rifles at hand as a civil requirement (and I mean real AR's). This is all due to how the country was developed.
On the other hand, the US has gradually become more rule-bound and seems to be doing exactly what the Roman Empire did to succumb to barbarians. As more and more citizens in the US become able to enjoy luxuries and leisure, they want the state to handle all their security. In the process they forget that security begins with the citizenry itself, leaving it to the professional warrior-class and the governmental security apparatus.
Even the poor and uneducated of the US now find themselves getting largesse from a Socialist government and enjoying their own newly found sense of empowerment, paying for it with their votes in order not to slide back to where they were at before welfare, earned-income credits and taxing the people that actually work even more.

I wrote a blog echoing these thoughts years ago.... glad somebody else thinks the same way

Regarding the Swiss citizenry or my anti-Socialist and eroding-the-fabric-of-society rant?

Second half, sorry