TexasCHLforum.com

I had a question come up that I wanted to run by the folks here.

My sister in law who is a non-chl holder asked that what would happen if she borrowed one of our vehicles and it happened to have a pistol in it and:

1. She was pulled over and she knew the pistol was in the vehicle.

or

2. She was pulled over and did not know the pistol was in the vehicle?

Obviously it would be best practice either inform her that there was a pistol in the vehicle that she was borrowing or to remove it.

My thoughts are:

For 1. above, as long as it was concealed and she made the officer aware of the pistol and she was legally able to be in possession of a firearm, all would be fine.

For 2. I'm not sure what the ramifications would be if the officer wanted to search the vehicle, she let them and they found it would be. I don't know how the whole "well I borrowed this and I didn't know this was in here" would go over.

Thoughts?

She do not have to tell since she has no CHL. Now, why search the vehicle in the first place? Let us say they found about it, where is the harn? unless your sis is a felon or while in the process of committing a felony, the pistol and your sis are in the clear.

Sorry - I'm a dyed in the wool cynic and have very few folks on my 'trust' list. I would not leave the weapon in the vehicle at all.

couzin wrote:Sorry - I'm a dyed in the wool cynic and have very few folks on my 'trust' list. I would not leave the weapon in the vehicle at all.

I'd give serious thought to driving her somewhere rather than loan her, or anyone else not named on my liability policy, my vehicle. The gun becomes secondary until the initial quandary is resolved.

As a general rule I personaly don't trust anybody with my guns or my vehicles but back on topic I don't think it would be an issue with the way state laws are written as long as she is legaly able to own a weapon and she isn't doing anything more than comitting a minor traffic offense

I personally would never loan a vehicle and leave a weapon in it. Suppose she picks up someone else? Leaves it unlocked? Too many if's here. Second, the Motorist Protection Act is very clear in that it must be Your vehicle under Your control. It would not be her vehicle, and it would not be under your control...thus does not meet the standard to be legal.

As they say, I aint a lawyer, but I am a thinker....

wgoforth wrote:I personally would never loan a vehicle and leave a weapon in it. Suppose she picks up someone else? Leaves it unlocked? Too many if's here. Second, the Motorist Protection Act is very clear in that it must be Your vehicle under Your control. It would not be her vehicle, and it would not be under your control...thus does not meet the standard to be legal.

As they say, I aint a lawyer, but I am a thinker....

Actually it states your vehicle OR vehicle under your control. Does not have to be your vehicle.

However, I am with the rest of the folks, it is not a good idea to let you gun out of your control period.

With firearms, I don't have a "trust" list. Take your gun out of the car before loaning it.

MoJo wrote:With firearms, I don't have a "trust" list. Take your gun out of the car before loaning it.

totally. Loaning a car and leaving a loaded gun in it is just asking for trouble.

Cars are dangerous weapons! Some 43,000 people are killed every year in automobile accidents. I'd never lend a car to someone; he could get killed.

Lumberjack98 wrote:I had a question come up that I wanted to run by the folks here.

My sister in law who is a non-chl holder asked that what would happen if she borrowed one of our vehicles and it happened to have a pistol in it and:

1. She was pulled over and she knew the pistol was in the vehicle.

or

2. She was pulled over and did not know the pistol was in the vehicle?

Obviously it would be best practice either inform her that there was a pistol in the vehicle that she was borrowing or to remove it.

My thoughts are:

For 1. above, as long as it was concealed and she made the officer aware of the pistol and she was legally able to be in possession of a firearm, all would be fine.

For 2. I'm not sure what the ramifications would be if the officer wanted to search the vehicle, she let them and they found it would be. I don't know how the whole "well I borrowed this and I didn't know this was in here" would go over.

Thoughts?

1. She should not notify. There is no requirement for a non-CHL to notify of a gun in the car.

2. The cop cannot search the car without probable cause. If she is asked to exit the vehicle, she should lock the door on her way out. If asked if they can search, the answer should be "Not without a warrant"

I would not allow a search of MY car without a warrant, and I would specially would not allow a search of a car I borrowed. I don't have any idea what the owner could have hidden in the car (drugs, a corpse, machine guns, etc)

Keith B wrote:

wgoforth wrote:I personally would never loan a vehicle and leave a weapon in it. Suppose she picks up someone else? Leaves it unlocked? Too many if's here. Second, the Motorist Protection Act is very clear in that it must be Your vehicle under Your control. It would not be her vehicle, and it would not be under your control...thus does not meet the standard to be legal.

As they say, I aint a lawyer, but I am a thinker....

Actually it states your vehicle OR vehicle under your control. Does not have to be your vehicle.

However, I am with the rest of the folks, it is not a good idea to let you gun out of your control period.

Ah, gotcha and thanks. But, if you loan the car, then it is no longer under your control and thus does not qualify for vehicle carry requirements, correct? If not, then wouldn't be illegal along with not a good idea?

PC 46.02 contains the traveling law. It states "motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control". Person here refers to the driver which can be the owner or any other person. If your sister is driving your car, it is under her control. She can carry concealed a handgun provided she meets all of the requirements to own a handgun. The vehicle does NOT have to be in the control of the owner.

PC 46.02 goes on to make it clear that the person who is in control of the vehicle can't be engaged in a criminal activity other than a Class C misdemeanor..., prohibited from possessing a firearm, or a member of a street gang. So long as a person legally has control of the vehicle they can carry concealed.

CompVest wrote:PC 46.02 contains the traveling law. It states "motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control". Person here refers to the driver which can be the owner or any other person. If your sister is driving your car, it is under her control. She can carry concealed a handgun provided she meets all of the requirements to own a handgun. The vehicle does NOT have to be in the control of the owner.

PC 46.02 goes on to make it clear that the person who is in control of the vehicle can't be engaged in a criminal activity other than a Class C misdemeanor..., prohibited from possessing a firearm, or a member of a street gang. So long as a person legally has control of the vehicle they can carry concealed.

I guess I'm reading that to mean the owner of the firearm must be the one in control of the vehicle. But then, I never leave one in a vehicle for fear that someone could break in and steal it anyway.

Thanks for the replies everyone!