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I'm really of two minds here...

Part of me hates DC and hates DC's ridiculous stand on the RKBA, would like to see DC go down in flames in court again, and sympathizes with the PPP.

The other part of me says, "there is nobody with a carry license anywhere in these United States who is unaware that DC won't honor their license." That part of me doesn't believe that the PPP didn't know, and believes that the PPP should have known better, and that, just maybe, the PPP made the decision to carry anyway, not expecting to get caught, and it just didn't work out for him.

It's kind of like, what would we all say if one of us got arrested for knowingly carrying past a legal and compliant 30.06 sign? I think most of us would agree that 30.06 signs - particularly compliant ones - are an abomination, and at least a partial infringement of our RKBA. But I also think that most of us would agree that the person who was arrested knew better, took a chance, and chance did not smile back at him. If that's the case, does the arrestee deserve sympathy, or does he deserve a "Yah big dummy! What did you expect?"

So truthfully, I'm of mixed emotions.

The Annoyed Man wrote:I'm really of two minds here...

Part of me hates DC and hates DC's ridiculous stand on the RKBA, would like to see DC go down in flames in court again, and sympathizes with the PPP.

The other part of me says, "there is nobody with a carry license anywhere in these United States who is unaware that DC won't honor their license." That part of me doesn't believe that the PPP didn't know, and believes that the PPP should have known better, and that, just maybe, the PPP made the decision to carry anyway, not expecting to get caught, and it just didn't work out for him.

It's kind of like, what would we all say if one of us got arrested for knowingly carrying past a legal and compliant 30.06 sign? I think most of us would agree that 30.06 signs - particularly compliant ones - are an abomination, and at least a partial infringement of our RKBA. But I also think that most of us would agree that the person who was arrested knew better, took a chance, and chance did not smile back at him. If that's the case, does the arrestee deserve sympathy, or does he deserve a "Yah big dummy! What did you expect?"

So truthfully, I'm of mixed emotions.

But we also tend to ask ourselves on this very forum, who is "man" enough to test an unjust law?

EDIT: Wow, I just noticed a very good comment when reading the article:

They have to honor my drivers license, they have to honor my marriage license. They should have to honor my carry permit!

Talk about an excellent point, especially when a DL and a Marriage License are not protected by our Constitution.

Purplehood wrote:But we also tend to ask ourselves on this very forum, who is "man" enough to test an unjust law?

No, you're absolutely right. The sad fact is that most of us have neither the money nor the time, so we don't test it. My guess is that if a Tennessee Baptist preacher were being paid highly enough by his congregation to test DC's law (as a non-resident of the district), then his salary might have been better spent on feeding the orphans and widows. I am predicting that the PPP will not pursue this up the judicial chain of command, hence it is a wasted arrest in that regard. That's why my reaction is to say to him, "You have my sympathy, but what did you expect would happen?"

The Annoyed Man wrote:

Purplehood wrote:But we also tend to ask ourselves on this very forum, who is "man" enough to test an unjust law?

No, you're absolutely right. The sad fact is that most of us have neither the money nor the time, so we don't test it. My guess is that if a Tennessee Baptist preacher were being paid highly enough by his congregation to test DC's law (as a non-resident of the district), then his salary might have been better spent on feeding the orphans and widows. I am predicting that the PPP will not pursue this up the judicial chain of command, hence it is a wasted arrest in that regard. That's why my reaction is to say to him, "You have my sympathy, but what did you expect would happen?"

Point taken.

The Annoyed Man wrote:I'm really of two minds here...

The other part of me says, "there is nobody with a carry license anywhere in these United States who is unaware that DC won't honor their license." That part of me doesn't believe that the PPP didn't know, and believes that the PPP should have known better, and that, just maybe, the PPP made the decision to carry anyway, not expecting to get caught, and it just didn't work out for him.

I agree with you but since I don't know what TN teaches in its CCW classes or how often PPP gets out of his State, I wouldn't be certain that he understood the situation in D.C. Yes, I fully agree that he SHOULD have understood that but there are a lot of very good people who just don't worry about things like that.

The funny part for me was the response. You would have thought it was an all out war - over two pistols under the seat of a car. How many different branches of law enforcement were involved? Aw, com on! If I read the crime statistics in D.C. correctly, the shooting rate is very high. I wander if every gun discovered among the "locals" gets that same treatment that PPP got. My point is that, like the border, the hammer of Thor comes thundering down on what are otherwise law abiding citizens who get caught in a relatively minor infraction while those who are deliberately outside the law are rarely acknowledged let alone punished. It effective punishment existed, the murder rate in the town probably wouldn't be as high.

Yeah, I have no idea what Tennessee licensing classes are like. It may be that, for a "shall issue" state, Texans have to jump through more hoops to get a CCW permit than do residents of other states; and so we tend to be consequently better informed about what we can and cannot do.

I couldn't tell from the story if he was prosecuted. It sounds like he spent the weekend in lockup and was released without them pressing any charges.

One must either know and abide by the law, or be prepared to face the legal ramifications imo...

jester wrote:I couldn't tell from the story if he was prosecuted. It sounds like he spent the weekend in lockup and was released without them pressing any charges.

If I read the article correctly, he spent the weekend in jail, went home and the charges were dropped 3 weeks later. He was working to have his record wiped clean and to get his guns back.

methinks someone in the DC prosecutor's office doesn't feel like making the name "Duncan" the third in a series behind "Heller" and "McDonald"

The Annoyed Man wrote:

Purplehood wrote:... his salary might have been better spent on feeding the orphans and widows.

I'd rather die free than be a slave with a full stomach. Make no mistake, the upcoming election is a battle for the survival of the American way of life on an epic scale. My grandfather fought the Japanese in WWII to defend liberty. I haven't dodged bullets, but the least I could do is financially support the right political candidates and drive all my elderly neighbors to the voting booth in November. I invite you to do the same.

drjoker wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:

Purplehood wrote:... his salary might have been better spent on feeding the orphans and widows.

I'd rather die free than be a slave with a full stomach. Make no mistake, the upcoming election is a battle for the survival of the American way of life on an epic scale. My grandfather fought the Japanese in WWII to defend liberty. I haven't dodged bullets, but the least I could do is financially support the right political candidates and drive all my elderly neighbors to the voting booth in November. I invite you to do the same.

I am not sure how my name got stuck in that quote. It should be attributed solely to TAM.

The Annoyed Man wrote:I'm really of two minds here...

Part of me hates DC and hates DC's ridiculous stand on the RKBA, would like to see DC go down in flames in court again, and sympathizes with the PPP.

The other part of me says, "there is nobody with a carry license anywhere in these United States who is unaware that DC won't honor their license." That part of me doesn't believe that the PPP didn't know, and believes that the PPP should have known better, and that, just maybe, the PPP made the decision to carry anyway, not expecting to get caught, and it just didn't work out for him.

I could see where this would happen to someone quite easily. When traveling by car in the DC area it is a 5 minute drive to go from VA (safe for CHL) to DC, to MD (somewhat safe for CHL). Many of the hotels along the periphery of the DC district may have a Virginia/MD address but are right on the line so crossing into the district is a 100 foot walk in some cases. However for this case the article stated he stayed in the hotel adjacent to FEMA which by deduction is the Capitol Holiday Inn in Federal Center Plaza. This hotel is adjacent to FEMA and across the street from Homeland Security and about 2 blocks from the National Mall so he was clearly in the heart of DC.

The hotel is 1.9 miles from the Virginia state line.

FEMA
Federal Center Plaza
500 C Street Southwest
Washington, DC 20024-2523

Holiday Inn Hotel Washington-Capitol
550 C Street SW
Washington, DC 20024


A story like this would have been more plausible and a little easier to swallow the "I did not know" excuse had he been staying somewhere on the VA/DC line such as

Residence Inn Arlington Pentagon City (CHL Legal)
550 Army Navy Drive
Arlington, VA 22202

Which is 0.2 mile (1000 feet) from the Pentagon and could possibly share parking with Pentagon facilities.

The Pentagon (Not CHL Legal)
1760 Air force pentagon
Washington, DC 20330

The Annoyed Man wrote:

Purplehood wrote:But we also tend to ask ourselves on this very forum, who is "man" enough to test an unjust law?

No, you're absolutely right. The sad fact is that most of us have neither the money nor the time, so we don't test it. My guess is that if a Tennessee Baptist preacher were being paid highly enough by his congregation to test DC's law (as a non-resident of the district), then his salary might have been better spent on feeding the orphans and widows. I am predicting that the PPP will not pursue this up the judicial chain of command, hence it is a wasted arrest in that regard. That's why my reaction is to say to him, "You have my sympathy, but what did you expect would happen?"

I understand the practical single case implications, but the overarching philosophical point is more important. The sad fact here is that we we're saying this man should have known that constitutional freedoms don't apply in our nation's capital and he should have known that before he visited the seat of the government and officials who are charged with defending those freedoms. He should have knowingly gone without providing for his family's safety there and been willing to suffer the consequences if one of DC's many free ranging thugs picked out his family members as victims because the people we pay to uphold the constitution abrogate it with impunity.

If this isn't a call to action to begin reclaiming those freedoms in November, I can't imagine what one would look like.