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What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 12:39 pm
by bobcat50
I need some clarification about "switchblade knives" in Texas. There are many different knife makers that make "assisted open" knives, such as Kershaw's Ken Onion knives and Gerber's F.A.S.T. knives. These are sold at Academy and many other retailers throughout Texas. They have a thumb stud or a finger stud on the knife blade itself and when you start to open the blade by pressing on this stud then gravity or a spring or centrifugal force allows the blade to swing open. It is not a push button like a traditional "switch blade". Are these types of assisted open knives considered to be switchblade knives in Texas ?
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:05 pm
by 74novaman
bobcat50 wrote:I need some clarification about "switchblade knives" in Texas. There are many different knife makers that make "assisted open" knives, such as Kershaw's Ken Onion knives and Gerber's F.A.S.T. knives. These are sold at Academy and many other retailers throughout Texas. They have a thumb stud or a finger stud on the knife blade itself and when you start to open the blade by pressing on this stud then gravity or a spring or centrifugal force allows the blade to swing open. It is not a push button like a traditional "switch blade". Are these types of assisted open knives considered to be switchblade knives in Texas ?
No they are not. Texas law specifically describes a button on the HANDLE. Since the Ken Onion just has a part of the blade you push on, it is not considered a switchblade in Texas.
Get one, use it, love it.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:28 pm
by Pawpaw
PC §46.01. DEFINITIONS. In this Chapter:
(11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a blade that
folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath and that opens automatically
by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the
handle or opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the
force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force. The term does
not include a knife that has a spring, detent, or other mechanism
designed to create a bias toward closure and that requires exertion
applied to the blade by hand, wrist, or arm to overcome the bias
toward closure and open the knife.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:40 pm
by flintknapper
bobcat50 wrote:I need some clarification about "switchblade knives" in Texas. There are many different knife makers that make "assisted open" knives, such as Kershaw's Ken Onion knives and Gerber's F.A.S.T. knives. These are sold at Academy and many other retailers throughout Texas. They have a thumb stud or a finger stud on the knife blade itself and when you start to open the blade by pressing on this stud then gravity or a spring or centrifugal force allows the blade to swing open. It is not a push button like a traditional "switch blade". Are these types of assisted open knives considered to be switchblade knives in Texas ?
I thought we had already answered your question in your other post?
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=41009" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Assisted opening knives (the mechanism) are legal in Texas. But you seem to misunderstand what an "assisted opening" knife is. Drop the
Gravity and
Centrifugal Force from your previous question and are you left with a "spring/cam/torsion" type "assist", which is legal (as long as they have a bias toward keeping the blade closed and the other features previously noted).
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:13 pm
by gigag04
But can you carry it while wearing a CHL badge and Hoi's tiara?
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:15 pm
by DONT TREAD ON ME
gigag04 wrote:But can you carry it while wearing a CHL badge and Hoi's tiara?
Only if you also have the sash. You have to have all three.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:51 pm
by cbr600
Neither the badge or tiara are good for concealment, so you need the sash to cover the gun (and other things) to avoid arrest.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:02 am
by bobcat50
Thank you for answering my question twice. I thought there was no such thing as a stupid question on here? As stupid as it may have been, it was clarification that I was seeking for my own comfort about the issue.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:14 am
by flintknapper
bobcat50 wrote:
Thank you for answering my question twice.
You are most welcome.
I thought there was no such thing as a stupid question on here?
I don't subscribe to that, its rare...but once in a while someone comes up with a doozie.
YOURS certainly was NOT a "stupid" question, I think it was a very good one in fact.
As stupid as it may have been, it was clarification that I was seeking for my own comfort about the issue.
Again, not "stupid"...and no one said it was. Just pointing out that all the information you seek was provided in the first post...in the form of direct answers and links to the appropriate Penal Codes and definitions.
Anyway, we are happy to have you here and equally happy to try and answer your questions. Some subjects have been covered many times...so someone might answer your question with just the basic facts and then direct you to another source, or suggest you use the search feature to get more input, thats all.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:46 am
by Abraham
Some of the boiler plate information of assisted opening knives, state words to the effect that the purchaser would be wise to check state/local ordinances where they live regarding the legality of carrying such knives.
I think this type of warning undermines folks confidence in owning one of this types of knives.
I know it has with me.
Given the warning seems to imply that it may legal here, but not there - within your own state, has caused me to pass on owning this type knife.
I'd hate to get stopped by an LEO in some Texas city and ultimately be told "Boy, you inna heap o'Trouble with that there knife - You caint carry such a thing in our town!"
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:17 am
by flintknapper
Abraham wrote:
Some of the boiler plate information of assisted opening knives, state words to the effect that the purchaser would be wise to check state/local ordinances where they live regarding the legality of carrying such knives.
Because (unfortunately) this is good advice. At present, only Arizona and New Hampshire have State Preemptive knife laws, meaning that there is "uniform" law throughout the State and that no "local ordinance" will have greater authority.
I think this type of warning undermines folks confidence in owning one of this types of knives.
I know it has with me.
I haven't seen where the assisted opening knives (as a matter of mechanics) have been targeted specifically, since the National clarification of the definition of "switch blade", but regardless of the type of knife, a patchwork of local ordinances can exist. For instance, ANY lock-blade knife in San Antonio!
Given the warning seems to imply that it may legal here, but not there - within your own state, has caused me to pass on owning this type knife.
I understand...and support your concerns. Currently, it is literally possible to be in compliance with an ordinance in one town, only to go 10 miles down the highway and be arrested. I would urge you to join here and help make a difference:
http://www.kniferights.org/index.php?op ... 8&Itemid=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'd hate to get stopped by an LEO in some Texas city and ultimately be told "Boy, you inna heap o'Trouble with that there knife - You caint carry such a thing in our town!"
Well....hopefully you won’t run into the Buford T. Justice type anymore.
But, LEO are often not “up” on knife laws, in fact…one of our own…just posted an illegal knife as being one with a blade 5.5”…when the law states
over 5.5”. No doubt a minor oversight, but incorrect and troublesome for a citizen.... if applied on the street.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:59 am
by Vic
Could someone help me understand the term "bias toward closure"?
In my mind, those words mean that the knife wants to close, bringing the blade into the handle, or the cutting edge into contact with the handle.
In an assisted-open knife, wouldn't the bias be toward opening?
I realize that I must be thinking incorrectly about this, and I'm not implying my statements are correct. I simply cannot "connect the dots" as to how that phrase means the opposite of what it seems to mean.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:16 pm
by gigag04
Good catch on the 5.5" thing. I actually know that to be the case but answered the question quite poorly!
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:19 pm
by Ol Zeke
I'm thinkin' ..... as my LEO Son-In-Law says...... If you're standin' with your hands on the hood, while the officer is goin' through the contents of your pockets.... what kinda' pocket knife you're carrying, is the least of your worries.
Re: What is considered a Switchblade Knife ?
Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:36 pm
by flintknapper
Vic wrote:Could someone help me understand the term "bias toward closure"?
In my mind, those words mean that the knife wants to close, bringing the blade into the handle, or the cutting edge into contact with the handle.
In an assisted-open knife, wouldn't the bias be toward opening?
I realize that I must be thinking incorrectly about this, and I'm not implying my statements are correct. I simply cannot "connect the dots" as to how that phrase means the opposite of what it seems to mean.
Hi Vic,
You understand it correctly, though I can see the reason for confusion. "Bias toward closure" was used as a distinction (however subtle) between Assisted Opening knives and Switch Blade/Automatic knives.
With an assisted opening knife (legal ones), some mechanism (spring, cam, torsion bar) holds the blade in a closed position UNTIL such time as it is influenced to move though an arc sufficient to let the bias work the other direction (open the blade). The means to initiate this movement is always located on the blade itself.
Switch blades (and certain other auto-knives), work with a mechanism that has constant tension (bias) toward opening, and the blade is held
captive by some sort of mechanical release (usually a button of some type).
Hope that helps. But you were correct in your thinking.
Flint