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I have read several discussion on Malls posting at their entrances but stores with outside entrances not being posted. I want and plan on obeying the law but is there any defense if I do accidentally enter? I'm sure I'll take the ride but...

Example - Katy Mill's Mall is posted but my wife dragged me into Bed Bath & Beyond which is not posted at their outside entrance. Since I knew the mall was posted I didn't carry but what if you were from out of town and were not aware of the signs at the mall entrances?

Or am I wrong and I can carry in Bed Bath & Beyond or any other business with an un-posted outside entrance as long as I do not step into the inside of the mall?

Thanks

Concealed means concealed.

If you enter thru an entrance that is not posted (and you have no knowledge that other areas are posted) you are not in violation of any Law.

If you are made, it is very possible that you will take the ride based on the LEO's interpretation of the Law but with money for a good Lawyer you should beat the rap.

Bottom line is: Is your safety worth disarming when you legally do not have to? Is the business something you can do without and go elsewhere. Do you want to be the test case should you be made or actually have to defend yourself while your in there?

It is a personal choice that only you can make.

Kirk wrote:I have read several discussion on Malls posting at their entrances but stores with outside entrances not being posted. I want and plan on obeying the law but is there any defense if I do accidentally enter? I'm sure I'll take the ride but...

Example - Katy Mill's Mall is posted but my wife dragged me into Bed Bath & Beyond which is not posted at their outside entrance. Since I knew the mall was posted I didn't carry but what if you were from out of town and were not aware of the signs at the mall entrances?

Or am I wrong and I can carry in Bed Bath & Beyond or any other business with an un-posted outside entrance as long as I do not step into the inside of the mall?

Thanks

Have you stopped and read those signs.

Simon Properties is one of the biggest discussion points regarding CHL's that I've ever seen. Well, except Jared.

Personally, if I don’t see a properly formatted, located sign in the course of my normal movements, parking lot to place of business, then I’m carrying. If I do see a sign, then I’m leaving. If it turns out there was a proper sign located at some other entrance, and somehow it was discovered I had a weapon and somehow it was sent to a LEO for action and somehow that LEO did not take a common sense approach that I obeyed the law as it is written and did not fail to comply with a posted sign at MY point of entrance, then I will take the ride, and deal with it then.

bronco78 wrote:Personally, if I don’t see a properly formatted, located sign in the course of my normal movements, parking lot to place of business, then I’m carrying. If I do see a sign, then I’m leaving. If it turns out there was a proper sign located at some other entrance, and somehow it was discovered I had a weapon and somehow it was sent to a LEO for action and somehow that LEO did not take a common sense approach that I obeyed the law as it is written and did not fail to comply with a posted sign at MY point of entrance, then I will take the ride, and deal with it then.

Once again I find that with bronco.

As for the OP's question, I would think but do not know for sure that if the mall is posted then so are the businesses with outer entrances (even if the outer entrances are not posted). IIRC the spaces that the businesses are in are leased to them by the owner of the mall. So, if the owner posts the mall 30.06 then the businesses have to abide by that regardless of outer entrances.

I do not know of a defense to prosecution for not using the posted entrance. One would hope that common sense would prevail in this type of situation but we all know how often that happens. Common sense being, if you are spotted or have to use your gun in self-defense and it turns out that the place was posted but you entered through an entrance that is not posted and did NOT know that there was an entrance that was posted, that you be left with a warning. This is why I think ALL entrances should be posted.

IANAL and these are just my thoughts. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Also, in 30.06 "entry" has the meaning that was assigned to it in 30.05 and in 30.05 it states that "Entry" means the intrusion of the entire body. The businesses that have outer entrances are still part of the "entire body" of the mall.

I am fairly certain that the statute means the entire body of the individual, not the building.

Didn't think of it that way. I was thinking along the lines of a building and/or land . Now that I go back and read it you are correct.

I completely missed the word intrusion which is key to the definition

Kirk wrote:Example - Katy Mill's Mall is posted but my wife dragged me into Bed Bath & Beyond which is not posted at their outside entrance. Since I knew the mall was posted I didn't carry but what if you were from out of town and were not aware of the signs at the mall entrances?

If they honestly don't know it's posted, they have no reason to do anything different than if it wasn't posted.

3dfxMM wrote:

Also, in 30.06 "entry" has the meaning that was assigned to it in 30.05 and in 30.05 it states that "Entry" means the intrusion of the entire body. The businesses that have outer entrances are still part of the "entire body" of the mall.

I am fairly certain that the statute means the entire body of the individual, not the building.

That's an interesting difference from the definition of "entry" for burglary. If the criminal reaches through a window and steals something, that's burglary. However, reaching through a window isn't trespassing.