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I went shopping at walmart in Austin. As I went in through the front door
three plain closed store guards were physically fighting with a shop lifter
during the fight some merchandise fell out from under the shop lifter's coat
There were no weapons involed . I stood on the side lines and stayed out of it
as the thief was dragged into a security office by force.

If the thief had produced a weapon at what point would I have been justifed
in using my carry gun ?????

tommyg wrote:I went shopping at walmart in Austin. As I went in through the front door
three plain closed store guards were physically fighting with a shop lifter
during the fight some merchandise fell out from under the shop lifter's coat
There were no weapons involed . I stood on the side lines and stayed out of it
as the thief was dragged into a security office by force.

If the thief had produced a weapon at what point would I have been justified
in using my carry gun ?????

ONLY if you find a situation in the Statutes below which is occurring ....

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/d ... m/PE.9.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
CHAPTER 9. JUSTIFICATION EXCLUDING CRIMINAL RESPONSIBILITY


Personally, I'd leave or duck or both if WalMart Security makes bad decisions..

To security you could have been an accomplice and escalated the situation. Back off and maintain vigilance for your safety and families safety.

WalMart has security personnel?

They were plain clothed (shop lifter catchers) loss prevention personell

tommyg wrote:They were plain clothed (shop lifter catchers) loss prevention personnel

Yeah, they've been sued before for false arrest/imprisonment, injuring people etc.
(I drafted such pleadings/all Written Discovery for a supervising attorney of record in such cases)

Retirement is good

RPB wrote:

tommyg wrote:They were plain clothed (shop lifter catchers) loss prevention personnel

Yeah, they've been sued before for false arrest/imprisonment, injuring people etc.
(I drafted such pleadings/all Written Discovery for a supervising attorney of record in such cases)

Retirement is good

One local WalMart here insists on seeing receipts from exiting shoppers. I just say "thank you, but no". I try to avoid that one and go to the other two which don't do the checks.
From my days in retail if you detained or questioned someone and made them produce a receipt it was legally tantamount to an accusation of shoplifting. We had to be very sure before we did it. It's been a long time since then, but I doubt Texas has changed the laws.

puma guy wrote: One local WalMart here insists on seeing receipts from exiting shoppers. I just say "thank you, but no". I try to avoid that one and go to the other two which don't do the checks.
From my days in retail if you detained or questioned someone and made them produce a receipt it was legally tantamount to an accusation of shoplifting. We had to be very sure before we did it. It's been a long time since then, but I doubt Texas has changed the laws.

I don't have a problem showing my receipts at the door. I do some ammo purchases at Wal-Mart and occasionally a "site to store", both of which require me to execute the purchase transaction in the back of the store and then walk out the front door with a bag or a box. Though I make a practice of immediately exiting after those types of purchases, I can understand why the store would want to verify that I didn't stop and throw some other items in my bag on the way out.

Now, it went beyond the receipt verification, we'd have a different problem. They'd better have some strong evidence to attempt to physically restrain me or attempt to detain me. I'd be on the cell phone, calling the LEOs faster than they could get their accusations out of their mouths. I just cannot imagine that happening.

I recall an incident that made the TV news, probably back in the '90s.

A couple with young children was detained in a room and interrogated simply because they had been writing down prices. Thankfully, Walmart no longer reacts as strongly to price comparisons.

Costco here checks every receipt at the exit door. I was at a Costco in Austin when I was there in October, and I believe they did the same. No hassle, and it's quite cursory, just a quick comparison between the receipt and what is in your cart.

I've been a member of Costco, and its predecessor, Price Club, since Sol Price and his son set up in Rose Canyon here in the mid-70's. It used to bother me, but not anymore, and it would bother me a lot less were I a Costco shareholder.

I was a stocker at a grocery store in high school. A man stole a carton of cigs and ran out the door. My manager, (of my dept) was only about 32, married with children. He ran out the door to the thief, who turnedaround, buried a knife in his stomach and fled. The manager died. Bottom line...leave them alone, stay put of the way, it aint your fight.

I was told Walmart uses the honesty policy for paying. You can load up a cart and take it out the in door and no one will stop you once you are outside. This new information is really surprising to hear. Maybe since the customer had hidden the merchandise on their person, the loss prevention people can go after them.

The checking of receipts is to verify the cashier has correctly checked you out. Cashiers sometime overlook things, especially from their friends or relatives.

Recently there was a woman exiting a WallyWorld in San Antonio carrying a shoplifted TV out the door when store personnel questioned her. The thief pulled a gun and the store folks backed off and called LEO. If that situation escalated and an employee got shot and I was nearby, it might be appropriate for me to get involved with deadly force. Kind of difficult to speculate since there are so many variables.

Once the three grabbed the alleged shoplifter, they owned the results. Good advice from others to keep a safe distance until you understand the situation and it is under control. BTW, with four writhing bodies would you be confident that you could safely execute a shot without hitting an unintended person?

JALLEN wrote:Costco here checks every receipt at the exit door. I was at a Costco in Austin when I was there in October, and I believe they did the same. No hassle, and it's quite cursory, just a quick comparison between the receipt and what is in your cart.

I've been a member of Costco, and its predecessor, Price Club, since Sol Price and his son set up in Rose Canyon here in the mid-70's. It used to bother me, but not anymore, and it would bother me a lot less were I a Costco shareholder.

Sam's does the same thing. I understand that it's part of your membership agreement to allow them to check your purchase prior to exiting the store...