TexasCHLforum.com

I posted this still in the Emily Miller gets her Gun thread.

terryg wrote:

hi-power wrote:Here's a link to a new Foxnews report about the DC registration that mentions Emily Miller. 2.5-minute video also.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/02 ... latestnews

The video still makes it look like she is shooting a phaser:

I don't want to hijack that thread, but I find this still fascinating. I am pretty sure the general flash is real. You can also see it in the video. But what is that rope path? Was this photo-shopped in for the still or actually captured. Is it the wake of the rifled projectile spinning through the muzzle flash? Any opinions or any see this type of image before?

Some indoor ranges use a target hanger that runs back & forth on a screw shaft. It looks to me like the muzzle flash just lit up the shaft, so it stands out. The rest of it is apparently hidden behind the gun and her arm.

Just my opinion. It's worth exactly what you paid for it.

Pawpaw wrote:Some indoor ranges use a target hanger that runs back & forth on a screw shaft. It looks to me like the muzzle flash just lit up the shaft, so it stands out. The rest of it is apparently hidden behind the gun and her arm.

Just my opinion. It's worth exactly what you paid for it.

I don't think so:


That still doesn't explain the phenomenon, although the idea of the wake of the spinning bullet is intriguing. I've never seen anything like that, including in high speed photography of rifle bullets exiting the muzzle—and they are spinning much faster than a pistol bullet.

The Annoyed Man wrote:

Pawpaw wrote:Some indoor ranges use a target hanger that runs back & forth on a screw shaft. It looks to me like the muzzle flash just lit up the shaft, so it stands out. The rest of it is apparently hidden behind the gun and her arm.

Just my opinion. It's worth exactly what you paid for it.

I don't think so:


That still doesn't explain the phenomenon, although the idea of the wake of the spinning bullet is intriguing. I've never seen anything like that, including in high speed photography of rifle bullets exiting the muzzle—and they are spinning much faster than a pistol bullet.

My thought to, an artifact of the photo rather than the actual picture. I have gotten several good pics of muzzle flash at IDPA night shoots and not one ever included such a streak.

If the ropy appearance was due to the projectile spinning, it should correspond to the rifling rate. I would calculate from what I can observe in the pic, that the rifling in that gun has about a 1 in 4 twist.

Also, since TAM drew a nice line for us, it appears that the rope leaves the muzzle at a very slight angle off from the axis of the bore, leaving me with the impression that the pic is photoshopped.

AndyC wrote:I would imagine that it's just the lines on the video - NTSC is what, 480 lines per inch? Anything that's crossing the horizontal lines at an angle would show the gaps between them, resulting in a rope-like appearance.

I can't think how else to explain this more fluently, sorry - need mo' coffee

Andy you never cease to amaze me. I assume you're not at Elm Fork this AM?

AndyC wrote:I would imagine that it's just the lines on the video - NTSC is what, 480 lines per inch? Anything that's crossing the horizontal lines at an angle would show the gaps between them, resulting in a rope-like appearance.

I can't think how else to explain this more fluently, sorry - need mo' coffee

I think that's the best explanation.

BTW Andy, Miss M1A has a new home as of today. I'll be introducing you to Brutus soon, but here is a preliminary pic:

Brutus sure is pertty!

The first thing I thought of was the bullet spin. Have those of you that have recorded bullets exiting used television quality hi-def cameras and at this angle? It still just a guess, but it sure looks like it came from the bullet and flash combination. I also watched for it on subsequent shots, but only noticed this on the first shot.

AndyC wrote:I would imagine that it's just the lines on the video - NTSC is what, 480 lines per inch? Anything that's crossing the horizontal lines at an angle would show the gaps between them, resulting in a rope-like appearance.

I can't think how else to explain this more fluently, sorry - need mo' coffee

You might be one the right track ... although it was more than than likely it was filmed with some type of HD camera so it would most likely be either be 720 or 1080 horizontal lines. I thinking it might be from the refresh rate, but that doesn't really work. If the muzzle velocity was ~ 1200 ft/sec and the refresh rate at 60 frames/sec, that would put the round traveling 20ft during a single frame so that doesn't really account for it.

AndyC wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:BTW Andy, Miss M1A has a new home as of today. I'll be introducing you to Brutus soon, but here is a preliminary pic:

If you die, can I have him?

You're going to have to deal with The Annoyed Boy first. .....and it is my intention to hang around and bother him for a long time. His kids will be old enough to shoot it before I shuffle off this mortal coil if I have any kind of say in the matter.

terryg wrote:

AndyC wrote:I would imagine that it's just the lines on the video - NTSC is what, 480 lines per inch? Anything that's crossing the horizontal lines at an angle would show the gaps between them, resulting in a rope-like appearance.

I can't think how else to explain this more fluently, sorry - need mo' coffee

You might be one the right track ... although it was more than than likely it was filmed with some type of HD camera so it would most likely be either be 720 or 1080 horizontal lines. I thinking it might be from the refresh rate, but that doesn't really work. If the muzzle velocity was ~ 1200 ft/sec and the refresh rate at 60 frames/sec, that would put the round traveling 20ft during a single frame so that doesn't really account for it.

My next thought was that the flash caused the artifact. It appears that a "shadow free" flash was used to fill from below, I wonder if a ringlight could have fired at enough different angles at one time, or within a short enough period, to result in a sequence of reflections that would look that way.

Interestingly - the article just ran on Fox 4 News here in the DFW area.