TexasCHLforum.com

New York (CNN) -- New York police on Sunday touted the impact of their much-criticized "stop, question and frisk" policy, claiming it has contributed to a spike in the number of firearms confiscated and coincided with what is shaping up to be a historically low murder rate.

Comparing numbers from the first three months of 2012 to the same period last year, the number of such stops increased 10% while the number of illicit guns taken away went up 31%, according to a New York Police Department statement from Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne.

Meanwhile, New York's murder rate has plunged 21% year-to-date as of last Friday -- meaning, if the current trend continues, the yearly number of murders in the city would be the lowest since such statistics first were recorded, as such, in 1963.

"New York City continues to be the safest big city in America, and one of the safest of any size, with significantly less crime per capita ... than even small cities," the department said.

Police cited Operation Impact and the "stop and frisk" policy as key reasons for the improving crime statistics. But the policy has been criticized sharply by some as grounds for racial profiling.

Donna Lieberman -- executive director of the New York Civil Liberties Union, which has described the practice as "unlawful and racially biased" -- blasted the latest release of data, accusing the police department of trying to "massage the numbers to make this look like an effective and worthwhile program."

"What (this policy) does is terrorize moms of color about the well-being of their sons, who have to navigate how to survive unwarranted intrusion into their activities by a police department for doing absolutely nothing wrong," she said Sunday in a statement.

Added Darius Charney, senior staff attorney for the New York-based Center for Constitutional Rights, "It is mind-boggling that, after years of public outcry and in the face of strong evidence that stop-and-frisk violates people's rights and does not make them safer, the NYPD has doubled down on this discriminatory and ineffective practice."

Another critic, City Council member Jumaane Williams, earlier this year questioned how the policy affects the police department's relations with minorities in the city.

"Communities are losing trust with the police, which is one of the biggest crime-fighting tools that we have," Williams said.

Minorities are far more likely than whites to be questioned under New York's program, according to police department statistics. Of those stopped and frisked -- 93% of whom were males -- 54% were African-American, 33% were Hispanic, 9% were white and 3% were Asian.

Yet the police department, including Commissioner Ray Kelly, has argued that the policy ends up disproportionately protecting those in minority communities. African-Americans and Hispanics made up 96% of all New York shooting victims and 90% of murder victims last year, police said. Therefore, a drop in such shootings citywide would logically equate to fewer minorities' being killed.

New York police pointed out there were 124 murders this year in the city through April 29, compared with 158 in Chicago -- which, with about 2.7 million people, has less than one-third of New York's population.

Those figures couldn't be clearly matched on the city of Chicago's website. Official crime data from Chicago did note 120 homicides in that city through April 20, while the Chicago Tribune's RedEye website recorded 169 homicides as of May 9.

"The continuing murder decline in New York is vindication of the NYPD's policy of engagement, which includes Operation Impact, police stop and questioning and use of the Real Time Crime Center to get timely information into detectives' hands as quickly as possible," New York police said in their statement Sunday.

Civil liberties advocate Lieberman acknowledged progress regarding crime, but disputed the idea that this can be credited to "stop, question and frisk" -- or that such trends aren't evident elsewhere without such policies.

"Crime has gone down and stop-and-frisk has gone up, but that doesn't meant that stop-and-frisk is (the) reason for reduction in crime. It's gone down in almost every city in the last decade," she said. "It's time for (Mayor Mike Bloomberg) and Police Commissioner Kelly to treat people of color as if they were their own families."

While 31% more firearms were recovered in the first quarter of 2012 compared to the same stretch one year prior, only 13% more weapons total were confiscated, according to police statistics. That is because most such seized weapons are knives, at about seven times the rate for guns.

The vast majority of those stopped, questioned and frisked walk free without punishment. According to data from 2012's first three months, 5% of those ended up being arrested and another 5% were served summons. Both rates are slightly below those from the previous year.

The Annoyed Man wrote:These kinds of orders come down from the top. I'd be willing to bet that Mayor Bloomberg is in this up to his tighty-whities. Is there any substantial difference....other than nationality......between that man and Vladimir Putin?

Dave2 wrote:Wait, lemmie make sure I've got this... The cops in NYC are randomly stopping people and frisking them? How is that legal?

• Amendment 4 - Search and Seizure. Ratified 12/15/1791.
  
  The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

The Annoyed Man wrote:But be aware when you're talking to your friends who think guns should be outlawed, THIS is the society they are asking for. Rub their noses in it a bit. What will they be able to stop you and search you for after they've gotten all the guns off the street (as if this would really work....)? Subversive literature demanding a Bloomberg recall? Copies of the Constitution?

CHAPEL HILL, N.C. (AP) -- New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg has told University of North Carolina graduates that last week's gay marriage vote shows there is still a lot of work to be done for civil rights in this country.

Bloomberg spoke Sunday to thousands of graduates at Kenan Memorial Stadium.

Bloomberg told them Americans have slowly understood since this country was founded that if the government can deny freedom to one person, it can deny freedom to everyone. The mayor says every generation has brought more freedom to this country, and he expects the latest generation to continue the work, especially after last Tuesday's vote approving a state constitutional amendment banning gay marriage in North Carolina.

Bloomberg also says the university's motto, "Light and Liberty," should be the defining spirit of this century.

The Annoyed Man wrote:In a sort of related vein....

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/ ... 3-17-14-47
May 13, 5:14 PM EDT
Bloomberg: NC marriage vote sets back civil rights

CHAPEL HILL, N.C. (AP) -- New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg has told University of North Carolina graduates that last week's gay marriage vote shows there is still a lot of work to be done for civil rights in this country.

Bloomberg spoke Sunday to thousands of graduates at Kenan Memorial Stadium.

Bloomberg told them Americans have slowly understood since this country was founded that if the government can deny freedom to one person, it can deny freedom to everyone. The mayor says every generation has brought more freedom to this country, and he expects the latest generation to continue the work, especially after last Tuesday's vote approving a state constitutional amendment banning gay marriage in North Carolina.

Bloomberg also says the university's motto, "Light and Liberty," should be the defining spirit of this century.

Forgetting the whole "gay marriage" thing.....how ironic is his statement highlighted above, given his trashing of the 2nd and 4th Amendments?

WildBill wrote:The only people who seem concerned about this are the groups like NYCLU who say that it targets minorities. I guess it's okay to stop and frisk people only if they're white. Where are the judges who are hearing these cases?

Another thing I thought was funny was that the numbers showed about 80% of the people stopped were "completely innocent." Does that mean the other 20% were not completely innocent or not completely guilty?

http://www.nyclu.org/issues/racial-just ... -practices" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Comparing numbers from the first three months of 2012 to the same period last year, the number of such stops increased 10% while the number of illicit guns taken away went up 31%, according to a New York Police Department statement from Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne.

sjfcontrol wrote:

Comparing numbers from the first three months of 2012 to the same period last year, the number of such stops increased 10% while the number of illicit guns taken away went up 31%, according to a New York Police Department statement from Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne.

Hmmmm...

So stops increased 10%, but # of guns went up 31% -- that implies to me that the "stop and assault" plan is causing 3 x more people to carry illegally this year than last.

If they wanted to show they were having an effect on illegal carry, the number of gun confiscations should have gone DOWN, not up.

VMI77 wrote:

sjfcontrol wrote:

Comparing numbers from the first three months of 2012 to the same period last year, the number of such stops increased 10% while the number of illicit guns taken away went up 31%, according to a New York Police Department statement from Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne.

Hmmmm...

So stops increased 10%, but # of guns went up 31% -- that implies to me that the "stop and assault" plan is causing 3 x more people to carry illegally this year than last.

If they wanted to show they were having an effect on illegal carry, the number of gun confiscations should have gone DOWN, not up.

You have to look at the politics. I think what they're trying to claim is that these stops are SO effective, that only 10% more of them yielded 31% more weapons --IOW, that increasing the number of stops has a high marginal utility. If they claimed that for 10% more stops they only got 1% more weapons, that would indicate that there is no value in increasing the number of stops, and what they're trying to do is justify MORE stops by saying a relatively few more stops produces a lot more benefit.

But the thing is, you can't believe any of their numbers in the first place...they're all crafted to justify whatever policy it is they want to impose.