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Paypal has gotten worse and worse over the years due to its monopolic start when the internet was young. Is there a reliable alternative?

DLC = DownLoadable Content

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/vi ... mpaign=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PayPal, for refusing to pay out the majority of the crowdfunding campaign's funds on the basis that it was not willing to take the risk that backers would demand refunds. The majority of backers to the campaign opted to pay through PayPal, which means the popular payment service was sitting on $700,000 of the $829,000 raised.
Read more at http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/vi ... uwR1QGe.99" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I pointed out this https://www.dwolla.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; several months back and almost got laughed out of the forum.

They don't come with the buyer protections that paypal offers but aren't sticking to you in fees either which is great if you are the seller.

Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point. There's no event for people to attend, no product to be shipped, and no service to use. PayPal is apparently keeping the money to issue refunds, but offered to release the remainder of the money if the company (game developer) would agree to pay any refund claims. The company refused, essentially taking the position those were donations. They didn't use the term "donations" but that's apparently how the money is being viewed by the gamer. (Yes, the pun was intended.)

All this aside, it comes down to the terms of the contract with PayPal. Can they hold the money or not? If they can, then the gamer knew it going in; if they can't, the gamer can sue.

Chas.

Square Up (https://squareup.com/) offers Square Wallet.

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

steve817 wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

steve817 wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

I've seen several musicians trying this same thing. . . a mix of "pre-order the album I haven't made yet" and accepting donations to fund the project with different funding levels getting perks, for example: lunch with the artist, a signed album, private concert, etc.

If its person to person I like using green dot money paks. Cheap and fast.

Charles L. Cotton wrote: That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

Sounds like Social Security!

I've been using PP since they came around. It's hard to trust anyone else. I've had to file claims a few times, and always got prompt service. Of course, they have their downfalls, too. If I'm dealing with someone I trust, we just send as gift to bypass fees. I'm sure they'll put a halt to that at some point.

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

steve817 wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

EA or Electronic Arts figured out a long time ago that the best way to make money from games is to release the same game every year. NFL99 - NFL2K13 have all been cash cows. If a good game is not profitable in this way they simply will cancel development or push up the release date of a game that is not ready. The standard way for a small or independent game company to raise capital is to go to a VC who only make their money back when the game company sells or to work with a publisher who will often demand intellectual property rights. Why should someone give up the rights to their creation just for the tools to create it. Moreso than any other medium fans feel they own what they consume ad will reward good game developers they trust with loyalty. There is a huge caveat emptor, but that has not stopped the successes so far. The most successfully funded game so far has been "Torment: Tides of Numenera" with 74,405 backers and $4,188,927 pledged of $900,000 goal

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

steve817 wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

Here is an outfit using the crowd funding model and there are several others. It is becoming very popular. I have along with others have received products based on this type of funding model. It's venture capital at its rarest.

http://www.indiegogo.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

RX8er wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

steve817 wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Reading the article, I can see why PayPal would be worried. A company solicits money ($800,000) to develop a character for a game. I've never heard of a company asking it's customers to advance/provide/donate R&D money, but that's beside the point.
Chas.

Crowd sourcing is a relatively new way of financing that doesn't require an individual or small company to jump through the hoops the banks sometimes make you jump through and you don't sign away your first born. There is usually some form of quid pro quo that varies depending on how much one donates.

That makes a pyramid scheme look legit. "Send me a bunch of money and I'll use it (or some of it and keep the rest) to try to develop a product I can then sell you. If it can't be done, thanks for the money!"

Chas.

Here is an outfit using the crowd funding model and there are several others. It is becoming very popular. I have along with others have received products based on this type of funding model. It's venture capital at its rarest.

http://www.indiegogo.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And, I find this one of particular interest; he's looking for donations to his 2A defense fund!!: http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/2nd-a ... fense-fund" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;