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and this is why we carry at church....wow!

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And I sing in the choir.

But this brings in to play a very large problem with church attacks. There are hundreds of people in the congregation on Sunday morning at one of our 3 services. At any time in the choir loft you will have a little over 100 people alone. This makes for a crowded shooting situation no matter. If the person has already made it up to someone and is stabbing them, you may not be able to shoot. Shoot-through's are a major concern and if the bullet goes through the one person, it will likely hit an innocent bystander. Even shots at 7 -10 feet can be tricky as the BG will be moving and trying to attack others.

These types of scenarios are going to be hard to deal with, and anyone that is in one needs to do a double check before they fire to make sure of their target and what's beyond it.

Keith B wrote:And I sing in the choir.

But this brings in to play a very large problem with church attacks. There are hundreds of people in the congregation on Sunday morning at one of our 3 services. At any time in the choir loft you will have a little over 100 people alone. This makes for a crowded shooting situation no matter. If the person has already made it up to someone and is stabbing them, you may not be able to shoot. Shoot-through's are a major concern and if the bullet goes through the one person, it will likely hit an innocent bystander. Even shots at 7 -10 feet can be tricky as the BG will be moving and trying to attack others.

These types of scenarios are going to be hard to deal with, and anyone that is in one needs to do a double check before they fire to make sure of their target and what's beyond it.

I've spent hours at our church looking at sight lines. During a service I'm not sure I could find a single shooting angle that wouldn't put someone behind a subject.

jmra wrote:I've spent hours at our church looking at sight lines. During a service I'm not sure I could find a single shooting angle that wouldn't put someone behind a subject.

Yep, hence the problem at church, shopping malls, etc. And the advantage you have at church is being able to take time to try and find those potential shooting lanes ahead of time. In an unfamiliar setting you will not have that time to pre-plan.

Keith B wrote:

jmra wrote:I've spent hours at our church looking at sight lines. During a service I'm not sure I could find a single shooting angle that wouldn't put someone behind a subject.

Yep, hence the problem at church, shopping malls, etc. And the advantage you have at church is being able to take time to try and find those potential shooting lanes ahead of time. In an unfamiliar setting you will not have that time to pre-plan.

Good reminder about situational awareness and the need to evaluate how you would respond to an attack, active shooter, active "knifer" situation if you couldn't shoot. I know there are many on this forum who carry every day / everywhere. My work situation doesn't allow me to do that so I do spend time thinking about how I would respond if I was unarmed.

This is a good reminder about what you would / could do if you were armed but couldn't shoot.

I wonder if the flutist even considered that he had a pretty good nightstick in his hand or if it happened so fast he didn't have time to think about it?

I sometimes wonder though if the bg might not stop in that situation if simply confronted, not always, a few of the bg's are in it to kill, but many of them are in a church for something else, there is a psychology there, but I'm not sure what and I'm not sure I'd want to count on it.