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quote from Captain Picard is a must read in light of the times we live in.

The country has gone off the rails insane. This is our future....facing ignorant robots with no sense of proportion, rationality, or decency and who feel empowered because they are agents of the State.

I had a few initial reactions:

- What an unnecessary bureaucratic mess.

- Well, now we're all a little safer, aren't we?

- I don't mind checking the wheelchair to some extent, but it should be done quickly, discreetly, sensitively, and without a circus.

- If TSA is going to exist, they need to transform into a customer service mentality instead of a gestapo mentality. I guarantee you I could run that organization, keep us more secure than they are, and change them to something that possibly enhances the traveling experience (but at the minimum is neutral).

- This like so many businesses in America right now. They all hire unqualified, uneducated rule followers who have no ability or authorization to make a decision on their own. These dolts are always in direct contact with the "customers". Once you get to about a 2nd-3rd level escalation, you're much more likely to find somebody who is reasonable, has critical thinking skills, can make a risk-based decision, and apply common sense or professionalism to a situation. Getting to that person can prematurely age you.

fickman wrote:I- I don't mind checking the wheelchair to some extent, but it should be done quickly, discreetly, sensitively, and without a circus.

Indeed. I could see checking a wheelchair. It should take all of 45 seconds. If you want to swab test it add 30 seconds (I've had my carry on bag tested before and it went very quickly). All of these things can be done effiiciently, quietly, politely, and calmly.

To parent: "checking in accord with procedures. This will only take a minute. We care going to do a quick hand search and swab search and you will be on your way. We'll also call a (whatever the little shuttle guy's title is) to speed you to your plane."
To child: "hey there, we're going to check your chair to make sure its nice and strong for the trip." check check check swab check done in about the time it takes to type it.
"All right, have a good trip. Here's X to speed you to your plane."

Don't get it.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:Don't get it.

Simple. It's a power trip. They have the power and you don't. And you and they know it.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

fickman wrote:I- I don't mind checking the wheelchair to some extent, but it should be done quickly, discreetly, sensitively, and without a circus.

Indeed. I could see checking a wheelchair. It should take all of 45 seconds. If you want to swab test it add 30 seconds (I've had my carry on bag tested before and it went very quickly). All of these things can be done effiiciently, quietly, politely, and calmly.

To parent: "checking in accord with procedures. This will only take a minute. We care going to do a quick hand search and swab search and you will be on your way. We'll also call a (whatever the little shuttle guy's title is) to speed you to your plane."
To child: "hey there, we're going to check your chair to make sure its nice and strong for the trip." check check check swab check done in about the time it takes to type it.
"All right, have a good trip. Here's X to speed you to your plane."

Don't get it.

Checking the wheelchair in this case is nonsense, and based on a ridiculous assumption: that an American family traveling with a handicapped child is going to blow themselves up. Pure hooey. And the fact they do it the way they do it PROVES that they KNOW there is no danger of there being any explosives. They gather around the "suspected bomber" in a group to check to see if there is a bomb? Come on....is that how you YOU'D do it? Of course not, and neither would anyone else who really believed it was possible the wheelchair concealed a bomb. A real terrorist with a real bomb would detonate it once all the idiots gathered round. If they believed there was any real possibility of a bomb showing up they'd have blast barriers set up and do remote checks. This is all baloney and nothing but pure security theater. If it wasn't they'd be checking the people MOST LIKELY to carry out terrorist attacks, not handicapped children, babies, and grandmas.

VMI77 wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

fickman wrote:I- I don't mind checking the wheelchair to some extent, but it should be done quickly, discreetly, sensitively, and without a circus.

Indeed. I could see checking a wheelchair. It should take all of 45 seconds. If you want to swab test it add 30 seconds (I've had my carry on bag tested before and it went very quickly). All of these things can be done effiiciently, quietly, politely, and calmly.

To parent: "checking in accord with procedures. This will only take a minute. We care going to do a quick hand search and swab search and you will be on your way. We'll also call a (whatever the little shuttle guy's title is) to speed you to your plane."
To child: "hey there, we're going to check your chair to make sure its nice and strong for the trip." check check check swab check done in about the time it takes to type it.
"All right, have a good trip. Here's X to speed you to your plane."

Don't get it.

Checking the wheelchair in this case is nonsense, and based on a ridiculous assumption: that an American family traveling with a handicapped child is going to blow themselves up. Pure hooey. And the fact they do it the way they do it PROVES that they KNOW there is no danger of there being any explosives. They gather around the "suspected bomber" in a group to check to see if there is a bomb? Come on....is that how you YOU'D do it? Of course not, and neither would anyone else who really believed it was possible the wheelchair concealed a bomb. A real terrorist with a real bomb would detonate it once all the idiots gathered round. If they believed there was any real possibility of a bomb showing up they'd have blast barriers set up and do remote checks. This is all baloney and nothing but pure security theater. If it wasn't they'd be checking the people MOST LIKELY to carry out terrorist attacks, not handicapped children, babies, and grandmas.

I agree as far as explosives go, but unfortunately, an all-American family may not be beyond putting drugs in their disabled child's wheelchair. (I know TSA isn't tasked with finding drugs, but that's what I was thinking of when I said I don't mind a quick check.)

Checking the wheelchair in this case is nonsense, and based on a ridiculous assumption: that an American family traveling with a handicapped child is going to blow themselves up. Pure hooey.

Prior to Boston I would have said no American would do that.

If you exclude it the terrorists will use that next. However you can make a very easy, quick, and polite search.

Mindless drones. Take a lesson from Israel and learn how to do it right.....

Idiots.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

fickman wrote:I- I don't mind checking the wheelchair to some extent, but it should be done quickly, discreetly, sensitively, and without a circus.

Indeed. I could see checking a wheelchair. It should take all of 45 seconds. If you want to swab test it add 30 seconds (I've had my carry on bag tested before and it went very quickly). All of these things can be done effiiciently, quietly, politely, and calmly.

To parent: "checking in accord with procedures. This will only take a minute. We care going to do a quick hand search and swab search and you will be on your way. We'll also call a (whatever the little shuttle guy's title is) to speed you to your plane."
To child: "hey there, we're going to check your chair to make sure its nice and strong for the trip." check check check swab check done in about the time it takes to type it.
"All right, have a good trip. Here's X to speed you to your plane."

Don't get it.

that's because you have a brain and you use it.

This is another example of why I will go to almost any length to avoid setting foot in an airport. I'd rather drive for three days than take an hour plane ride.

The American public - all suspects - and treated like it.

And I too will now drive when once I'd take a plane.

My international travel days are over.

If I can avoid being abused, that's what I do.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

Checking the wheelchair in this case is nonsense, and based on a ridiculous assumption: that an American family traveling with a handicapped child is going to blow themselves up. Pure hooey.

Prior to Boston I would have said no American would do that.

If you exclude it the terrorists will use that next. However you can make a very easy, quick, and polite search.

What does Boston have to do with an American family blowing themselves up with their children? How are terrorists going to get an American family to blow themselves and their children up? And how on earth is the kind of check they do going to result in anything but the supposed "terrorists" detonating themselves on the spot? I'm afraid your logic just doesn't work, since the "next" thing is walking into an airport with a suitcase bomb. What you going to do about that? Ban people from carrying luggage on a trip? The fact is, the probability of the wheelchair and grandma threat is so remote that TSA takes NO PRECAUTIONS when making these checks --it's not security, it's security theater.

Abraham wrote:The American public - all suspects - and treated like it.

And I too will now drive when once I'd take a plane.

My international travel days are over.

If I can avoid being abused, that's what I do.

No, not all of us: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorial ... osques.htm

Homeland Insecurity: The White House assures that tracking our every phone call and keystroke is to stop terrorists, and yet it won't snoop in mosques, where the terrorists are.

That's right, the government's sweeping surveillance of our most private communications excludes the jihad factories where homegrown terrorists are radicalized.

Since October 2011, mosques have been off-limits to FBI agents. No more surveillance or undercover string operations without high-level approval from a special oversight body at the Justice Department dubbed the Sensitive Operations Review Committee.

They're not really interested in terrorists.....this government considers us to be the enemy, not terrorists.

VMI77 wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

Checking the wheelchair in this case is nonsense, and based on a ridiculous assumption: that an American family traveling with a handicapped child is going to blow themselves up. Pure hooey.

Prior to Boston I would have said no American would do that.

If you exclude it the terrorists will use that next. However you can make a very easy, quick, and polite search.

What does Boston have to do with an American family blowing themselves up with their children? How are terrorists going to get an American family to blow themselves and their children up? And how on earth is the kind of check they do going to result in anything but the supposed "terrorists" detonating themselves on the spot? I'm afraid your logic just doesn't work, since the "next" thing is walking into an airport with a suitcase bomb. What you going to do about that? Ban people from carrying luggage on a trip? The fact is, the probability of the wheelchair and grandma threat is so remote that TSA takes NO PRECAUTIONS when making these checks --it's not security, it's security theater.

One of the Boston bombers was an "American Family" member.
I believe the Fort Hood shooter was also a US citizen (I could be wrong there).
Wasn't Jose Padilla also a US citizen?
Women have been used as homicide bombers. Why not rig something that goes through a scanner, or firearms for a hostage situation.
If there is a weakness, if they have the power they will attempt to exploit it.

I understand the need to check, but the check itself is easily minimally invasive and consumes almost no time (same time as quick frisk as you're "frisking" the wheel chair as it were).