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An acquaintance told me quite some time ago a story about confrontation he had where I think it was a hay delivery that was the wrong stuff or something, anyway the "discussion" escalated to where the acquaintance pulled...a loaded magazine out of his pocket and waved it at the guy and that ended the standoff in my acquaintance's favor.

Was there anything unlawful about this? Yeah I know you can't pull your weapon and wave it, but...a magazine? I think he said it was loaded, maybe not...but it clearly had the desired effect on the guy who was trying to scam him.

May have had the desired effect, but IMHO it was a stupid thing to do.

If it is construed as threatening bodily injury, it can be considered a criminal offense.

Note, if someone waved a magazine at me, I would interpret it as threatening .

For example:

Sec. 22.01. ASSAULT. (a) A person commits an offense if the person:

(2) intentionally or knowingly threatens another with imminent bodily injury, including the person's spouse;

OR

Sec. 22.07. TERRORISTIC THREAT. (a) A person commits an offense if he threatens to commit any offense involving violence to any person or property with intent to:

(2) place any person in fear of imminent serious bodily injury;

TomsTXCHL wrote:Was there anything unlawful about this? Yeah I know you can't pull your weapon and wave it, but...a magazine? I think he said it was loaded, maybe not...but it clearly had the desired effect on the guy who was trying to scam him.

I don't have enough information to know if it was legal. If waving the magazine was a way to threaten another with imminent bodily injury, that's assault. If you wave a magazine at the range to tell your buddy to bring some more, that has a different intent.

The Dude wrote:

TomsTXCHL wrote:Was there anything unlawful about this? Yeah I know you can't pull your weapon and wave it, but...a magazine? I think he said it was loaded, maybe not...but it clearly had the desired effect on the guy who was trying to scam him.

I don't have enough information to know if it was legal. If waving the magazine was a way to threaten another with imminent bodily injury, that's assault. If you wave a magazine at the range to tell your buddy to bring some more, that has a different intent.

Same as waving a baseball bat.

WildBill wrote:Same as waving a baseball bat.

The context is very important.

I'm going with terroristic threat on this particular scenario.

OK, well, as I heard the story from him, the context was such that he was basically at risk of getting goods that were mis-represented to him, which at least in my not-a-lawyer estimation would count as "theft", therefore I suspect that if the guy had gone-ahead and brought charges against him his defense would have been "I was being robbed".

Lessee here, making-up a possible escalation, it would start with shouting, then fist-waving, then maybe a push here or a shove there, and/or a grasping or waving of a tool you have handy cuz you're rigging a trailer to get the hay home, then the magazine comes out, and finally the weapon itself (heck I don't even recall if my acquaintance was carrying a firearm, or even if he had one in his truck).

I don't know what I'd have done in his situation, but I appreciate y'all's replies here.

TomsTXCHL wrote:OK, well, as I heard the story from him, the context was such that he was basically at risk of getting goods that were mis-represented to him, which at least in my not-a-lawyer estimation would count as "theft", therefore I suspect that if the guy had gone-ahead and brought charges against him his defense would have been "I was being robbed".

Lessee here, making-up a possible escalation, it would start with shouting, then fist-waving, then maybe a push here or a shove there, and/or a grasping or waving of a tool you have handy cuz you're rigging a trailer to get the hay home, then the magazine comes out, and finally the weapon itself (heck I don't even recall if my acquaintance was carrying a firearm, or even if he had one in his truck).

I don't know what I'd have done in his situation, but I appreciate y'all's replies here.

You're trying to make orange juice with apples and lemons. There is simply no way to justify his actions unless force or deadly force was justified. If it was, then he should have pulled his gun instead of a magazine. But in this case there is nothing to suggest that force or deadly force was justified.

That was stupid move whenever there is confrontation of a sort.

I guess I should mention that sometimes I do joke with "my friend", a rep at the cashier. I would ask: "Do you like to be paid in bullets or plastic? "

What if he'd waved a "Playboy" at him?

Abraham wrote:What if he'd waved a "Playboy" at him?

That sounds like a loaded question.

TomsTXCHL wrote:OK, well, as I heard the story from him, the context was such that he was basically at risk of getting goods that were mis-represented to him, which at least in my not-a-lawyer estimation would count as "theft", therefore I suspect that if the guy had gone-ahead and brought charges against him his defense would have been "I was being robbed".

Lessee here, making-up a possible escalation, it would start with shouting, then fist-waving, then maybe a push here or a shove there, and/or a grasping or waving of a tool you have handy cuz you're rigging a trailer to get the hay home, then the magazine comes out, and finally the weapon itself (heck I don't even recall if my acquaintance was carrying a firearm, or even if he had one in his truck).

I don't know what I'd have done in his situation, but I appreciate y'all's replies here.

Robbery is a species of theft, usually defined as theft by force or fear.

Theft is taking the property of another with intent to permanently deprive the owner of it. Paying for goods which are other than as represented is not usually considered theft.

The way you avoid getting goods that are misrepresented is to not pay for them, don't accept them.

Hopefully for your friends sake he was just embellishing the story some. If it's true, then I say bad move. He could have gone to jail for the threat or worse, what if the other guy saw his magazine and raised him a locked and loaded pistol?

I mean, after all, it was just hay. It wasn't like he was selling him something worth dying over like crack or 20" rims.

Just my take, but waving a magazine, loaded or not, is not all that threatening on its own. Without the gun to stick the mag in, it's essentially an expensive blunt object, and not one very useful for bludgeoning or throwing. All could change depending on what words accompany the mag-waving. Questions like "Do you want me to use this?" and "Do you want some of this?" are, by nature, threatening; using the magazine as a prop in that context would, in my opinion, constitute a verbal threat of deadly force. Waving it around on its own, though, might as well wave a roll of dimes, which would be a MORE effective weapon than a lone magazine, loaded or not.