**"Waiters" of the Lost Ark**

[badkarma56]

Greetings fellow "would be" CHL holders,

I recently joined the forum, and completed my CHL course, so I figured that I'd come on in and get in line with everyone else!

After finishing my training on Saturday, 7 July, at Top Gun in Houston, I got home and re-checked EVERY document in my packet 3 times (I'd already reviewed my application three previous times before leaving the range)! I decided not to wait until Monday to mail the packet to DPS, so I went down to my local post office at around 1:30 a.m. and used the Automated Postal Center to purchase postage and labels for the packet. On the advice of some of the more senior members of this forum, I decided to send the packet a la certified first class mail/return receipt requested. Call me a cynic, but bureacratic organizations always seem to get to work faster on license-related stuff when they know that you have proof that the documentation was delivered to them. As such, I consider the six bucks I plunked down on postage to be money well spent. I had already paid the fee and done the online app in late-June, so I'm hoping that this expedites the process a bit.

I don't foresee any processing issues with my app. (i.e., clear record, Texas resident, adequate listing of work/residence history, no missing signatures, etc.), but upon reviewing my Texas CHL Law handbook (you know, the outdated government pamphlet that you received in CHL class or from DPS directly). In the FAQ section of the pamphlet, Texas appears to want a photocopy of your Texas driver's license to be submitted with the other application materials. What the heck!

**See page 58, second paragraph: "The application packet will include information about materials you need to return with your application packet. These include...a copy of your Texas driver license or identification card..."

I do not recall seeing this requirement in any of the forms that I received from DPS after initiating the online CHL application. Furthermore, my CHL course instructor did not mention that we needed to submit a copy of our driver's license to DPS.

Please tell me that I'm just trippin' out over nothing here! The absolute last thing I want to do is haggle with some salty bureaucrat over the phone about an incomplete application! For the time being, I'm going to assume that submission of a copy of your DL is no longer a requirement, assuming it ever was. Since the CHL handbook is pretty out of date (last revised in January 2006), I feel pretty secure.

Thanks in advance,
-BK

[BrassMonkey]

A copy of a DL would be one type of document establishing residency and age requirements have been met for application.

Administrative Rule 6.15


An applicant must complete the application materials required by this section and forward the completed materials to the department at its headquarters in Austin or submit an application online using the department website. Except as otherwise provided, an application must contain all the following items:

(1) Proficiency certificate. The applicant must submit a handgun proficiency certificate issued upon successful completion of a handgun proficiency course approved by the department and taught by a certified handgun instructor. A proficiency certificate, which is more than two years old, will not be accepted by the department.

(2) Application form. The applicant must submit a completed application on Form CR-78, which is adopted for that purpose. The applicant must complete the unique application form provided to that individual by the department. An application form may not be transferred or exchanged, or submitted by another applicant. The application form will require a statement of the applicant's:

(A) full name and place and date of birth;

(B) race and sex;

(C) residence and business addresses for the preceding five years;

(D) hair and eye color;

(E) height and weight;

(F) driver license number or identification certificate number issued by the department;

(G) criminal history record information, including a list of offenses for which the applicant has been arrested or charged under an information or indictment, and the disposition of each offense; and

(H) history during the preceding five years, if any, of treatment received by, commitment to, or residence in:

(i) a drug or alcohol treatment center licensed to provide drug or alcohol treatment under the laws of this state or another state; or

(ii) a psychiatric hospital.

(3) Proof of residency in this state. Unless an applicant is eligible for a non-resident license under the Act or is eligible under paragraph (4) of this subsection, the applicant must provide proof of residence in this state for the six-month period preceding the date of application. Residency may be shown by the following types of documents:

(A) proof that the applicant has been issued and has maintained an unexpired Texas driver license or personal identification card issued by the department for six months or longer; provided further, that possession by an applicant of a driver license issued by another state constitutes prima facie evidence of residency in such other state;

(B) proof that the applicant has been registered to vote in this state for six months or longer;

(C) proof that the applicant has owned or leased a residence in this state for six months or longer. Deed records, rental contracts, rental receipts, or canceled checks showing payment of rent may be used to support a claim of residency;

(D) records of utility payments; or

(E) other proof acceptable to the department.

(4) Proof of relocation with intent to establish residency in this state. Unless an applicant is eligible for a non-resident license under the Act or is eligible under paragraph (3) of this section, the application must provide proof of intent to establish residency in this state. Intent to establish residency may be shown by the following types of documents;

(A) proof that the applicant has been issued and maintains an unexpired Texas driver license or personal identification card issued by the department; provided further, that possession by an applicant of a driver license issued by another state constitutes prima facie evidence of residency in such other state;

(B) proof that the applicant is currently registered to vote in this state;

(C) proof that the applicant owns or leases a residence in this state. Deed records, rental contracts, rental receipts, or canceled checks showing payment of rent may be used to support a claim of residency;

(D) records of utility payments; or

(E) other proof acceptable to the department.

(5) Two recent color passport photographs of the applicant. The applicant shall submit two identical photographs of the applicant to the person who fingerprints the applicant, as detailed in paragraph (6) of this section. The photographs must be un-retouched color prints. Snapshots, vending machine prints, and full length photographs will not be accepted. The photographs must be 2 by 2 inches in size. The photographs must be taken in normal light, with white or off-white background. The photographs must present a good likeness of the applicant taken within the last six months. The photographs must present a clear, frontal image of the applicant, and include the full face from the bottom of the chin to the top of the head, including hair. The image of the applicant must be between 1 and 1-3/8 inches. Only the applicant may be portrayed.

(6) Two fingerprint cards. The applicant must be fingerprinted by a person appropriately trained in recording fingerprints who is employed by a law enforcement agency or by a private entity designated by a law enforcement agency, as an entity qualified to take fingerprints of an applicant for a license. The applicant must display a Texas driver license or personal identification card issued by the department. The applicant must deliver two passport photographs as described in paragraph (5) of this section, two blank fingerprint cards supplied by the department, and an instruction page included in the application materials on Form CR-75, which is adopted for that purpose. An instructor applicant is not required to submit photographs. Two complete sets of legible and classifiable fingerprints of the applicant must be recorded on cards provided by the department. The person who records the applicant's fingerprints shall:

(A) verify that the passport photographs are of the person being fingerprinted (not required for instructor applicants);

(B) either complete or verify the accuracy of the non-fingerprint data being submitted on the card;

(C) record the individual's fingerprints on the card, in a manner consistent with that normally done for an arrest fingerprint card, including the simultaneous impressions;

(D) obtain the signature of the license applicant on both the fingerprint cards and on the back of one of the passport photographs; (not required for instructor applicants). The applicant's signature must comply with §15.21 of this title (relating to Signature);

(E) sign the fingerprint card and the back of the same passport photograph signed by the applicant; (not required for instructor applicants); and

(F) return all documents to the applicant to be forwarded to the department.

(7) Affidavits. The applicant must execute and submit affidavits which in substance state the following:

(A) the applicant has read and understood each provision of the Act that creates an offense under the laws of this state, and each provision of the laws of this state related to the use of deadly force. Form CR-86L is adopted for this purpose;

(B) the applicant fulfills all the eligibility requirements for a license to carry a concealed handgun. Form CR-87L is adopted for this purpose; and

(C) the applicant authorizes the director to make inquiry into any non-criminal history records that are necessary to determine the applicant's eligibility for a license. Form CR-85L is adopted for this purpose.

(8) Signature of applicant. The applicant must sign the passport photograph holder provided by the department. The applicant's signature must comply with §15.21 of this title (relating to Signature).

(9) Fee. Except as otherwise provided, the applicant must submit a nonrefundable fee of $140 with the application for license. The fee must be in the form of a cashier's check, money order, or a check issued by a federal, state, or local government agency, made payable to the Texas Department of Public Safety.

(10) Proof of age. Proof of age may be established by a Texas driver license or personal identification card issued by the department. If an applicant cannot show proof of age through a driver's license or personal identification card issued by the department, the applicant must submit alternative proof of age. The applicant may submit a certified copy of the applicant's birth certificate as prescribed in §15.24 of this title (relating to Birth Certificate Or Other Acceptable Evidence).

(11) Social Security number. An applicant must provide the applicant's Social Security number. This information is required to assist in the administration of laws relating to child support enforcement, as required and authorized by Family Code, §231.302.

(12) Failure to provide information. If an applicant fails to provide all required application materials, or fails to respond to a request by the department for additional information necessary to process the application, the application process will be terminated as set out in §6.17(a) of this title (relating to Application Review and Background Investigation).


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Source Note: The provisions of this §6.15 adopted to be effective January 8, 1996, 20 TexReg 11128; amended to be effective August 19, 1999, 24 TexReg 6307; amended to be effective December 25, 2003, 28 TexReg 11340

[badkarma56]

BrassMonkey:

Thanks for the response, I'm now a bit miffed by this startling realization. Am I now to assume that I should also separately submit/mail a photocopy of my driver's license to the very bureau that issued the license to me in the first place? They can't access their own database and see my DL? Did you include a copy of your DL when you applied?

Further, why on Earth doesn't DPS simply tell you to include this photocopy of the DL on one of the many forms that they forward to persons like me who apply online? Are applicants who use the standard "pen and paper" applications (issued on-site by CHL instructors) told to include a photocopy of their DL? I've reviewed my application materials again since my original post, and I don't see the copied DL requirement listed anywhere.

Oh well, I thought I was good-to-go after dropping my packet into the mail...now I'm concerned and perplexed.

[badkarma56]

BrassMonkey, you wouldn't happen to be jerkin' my chain on this whole DL issue, would you? If so, very funny...

[BrassMonkey]

Not at all. Copied and pasted from DPS Website.

[seamusTX]

If you are a Texas resident, you do not have to send a photocopy of your Texas driver license.

Those requirements apply to people who are in the military and that sort of thing, who may not have a Texas driver license.

- Jim

[BrassMonkey]

I'm real sorry then badkarma, I did not see that stipulation...

Can you point that out to me Seamus? I am afraid I can't find it in the text...

[p-89]

I mailed mine on june 4th and the next day i saw that on the web. I called Austin, and the nice lady that answered told me that they did't realy need it and everything yould be fine.

[seamusTX]

I'm real sorry then badkarma, I did not see that stipulation...

Can you point that out to me Seamus? I am afraid I can't find it in the text...

It's not stated clearly.

The person who takes your fingerprints and notarizes your affidavits confirms that your ID is valid.

ElGato (CHL instructor known to many of us) checks every document in everyone's packet. He does not tell people who have a Texas driver license and were born in the U.S. to send copies of their ID, and their applications go through.

It is mainly people who were not born in the U.S. who have to send supporting documentation, or, as I said in the military and not a long-time Texas resident.

- Jim

[BrassMonkey]

Thanks for clearing that up.

[badkarma56]

Whew! Good deal, thanks SeamusTX and P-89 for providing clarification on this DL issue. I am a TX resident-born and bred in Houston-and while I am a veteran, I've been out of the Navy since 1997.

BTW, No hard feelings, BrassMonkey, but you darn near gave me a heart attack!

Thanks again,
-BK

[BrassMonkey]

You would have to blame the coronary on whomever writes the administrative code... :-)

[badkarma56]

You would have to blame the coronary on whomever writes the administrative code... :-)

Right you are, amigo!