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AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:35 am
by cmgee67
Howdy guys I just bought a PSA stripped glock 9mm lower and would like to make it into an AR pistol. They have the 16" uppers where it would be a rifle but if I just bought their 10.5" upper and don't put a stock on it would it be considered a pistol and not an SBR? I'm not after an SBR I want to make it a pistol. It's my new project and I want to be 100% legal and ok.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:50 am
by bigtek
I think the safest way is using a bare pistol buffer tube for the build. It's not readily converible to SBR because it won't accept a stock. A bare tube also doesn't look like SBR at a distance unlike a SIG brace or Shockwave Blade.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:59 am
by troglodyte
Run a pistol buffer tube off the back and you have a pistol.
Not in stock right now but this would finish out your lower. You can piece a kit together without too much trouble.
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-moe- ... black.html
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 12:19 pm
by parabelum
with the pistol buffer tube.
Check out Sig Brace or KAK Shockwave as well.
Generally, I think it is better to start out as a pistol build, since the rule is once a rifle (when you put a regular stock), always a rifle...
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 12:23 pm
by cmgee67
Ok guys thank you so much for the help!
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 1:44 pm
by tyree
cmgee67 wrote:I'm not after an SBR I want to make it a pistol. It's my new project and I want to be 100% legal and ok.
If I remember correctly, unless the manufacturer (PSA) sold it to you as a pistol lower, the ATF will consider it a rifle unless you do some extra ATF paperwork. Just placing a short barrel on the lower as is may get you some unwanted attention.
I.e. If PSA advertised it as a pistol lower, you should be good to go. If they advertised ot as a rifle lower, you'll need to do some paperwork before you can place a short barrel on it. If PSA didn't say anything one way or another, I suggest you get some clarification first.
The aforementioned paperwork is probably going to be the sbr route. Although i seem to remember it being possible to change the legal status rifles to pistols, i seem to remember that being an issue for some.
I hope you enjoy the build. Sounds fun. But, you may want to look into the legal ramifications of build direction choices a little more first.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 2:56 pm
by apostate
tyree wrote:
If I remember correctly, unless the manufacturer (PSA) sold it to you as a pistol lower, the ATF will consider it a rifle unless you do some extra ATF paperwork.
You may want to read the instructions for question 18 on form 4473.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 3:02 pm
by Skiprr
tyree wrote:cmgee67 wrote:I'm not after an SBR I want to make it a pistol. It's my new project and I want to be 100% legal and ok.
If I remember correctly, unless the manufacturer (PSA) sold it to you as a pistol lower, the ATF will consider it a rifle unless you do some extra ATF paperwork. Just placing a short barrel on the lower as is may get you some unwanted attention.
I don't believe that is correct. Here are a couple of BATFE references:
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/rulin ... s/download; BATFE Ruling 2011-4
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/can-i-l ... ng-firearm; short response to the question, "Can I lawfully make a pistol into a rifle without registering that firearm?"
From the former, I think the pertinent info is under the heading "Assembly of Weapons from Parts Kits":
BATFE Ruling 2011-4 wrote:Therefore, so long as a parts kit or collection of parts is not used to make a firearm regulated under the NFA (e.g., a short-barreled rifle or “any other weapon” as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(e)), no NFA firearm is made when the same parts are assembled or reassembled in a configuration not regulated under the NFA (e.g., a pistol, or a rifle with a barrel of 16 inches or more in length). Merely assembling and disassembling such a rifle does not result in the making of a new weapon; rather, it is the same rifle in a knockdown condition (i.e., complete as to all component parts). Likewise, because it is the same weapon when reconfigured as a pistol, no “weapon made from a rifle” subject to the NFA has been made.
Nonetheless, if a handgun or other weapon with an overall length of less than 26 inches, or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length is assembled or otherwise produced from a weapon originally assembled or produced only as a rifle, such a weapon is a “weapon made from a rifle” as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(4). Such a weapon would not be a “pistol” because the weapon was not originally designed, made, and intended to fire a
projectile by one hand.
To my knowledge, there has never been a law or BATFE ruling stating that an AR lower receiver intended for use as a pistol must be stamped, marked, or sold with a designation that it is for use as a pistol only.
IANALANISILA: I am not a lawyer and nothing I say is legal advice.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:57 pm
by cmgee67
Here's what I bought
http://palmettostatearmory.com/blem-psa ... ector.html
Doesn't say it's for rifle. All it is is a receiver.
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 6:11 pm
by cmgee67
According to the NRA a factory fresh receiver like the one I bought that has never been a part of a firearm can be made into a rifle pistol or SBR. And I am going to use an ar pistol lower parts kits from psa it's all
Pistol length buffer tube spring and everything. So I'm pretty sure I'm ok. When I pick up the receiver at the ffl I'm having it shipped to it will be registered as a pistol
https://www.americanrifleman.org/articl ... s-at-home/
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 6:41 pm
by Skiprr
cmgee67 wrote:When I pick up the receiver at the ffl I'm having it shipped to it will be registered as a pistol.
Actually, no; it probably won't be recorded (not registered...whole nuther can o' worms there) as a pistol. And it doesn't need to be.
As mentioned uptopic, question #18 on Form 4473 is filled in by the FFL, not the buyer. IMHO, If you're buying a receiver only, that will be checked as "Other Firearm," not as "Handgun" or "Long Gun."
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 6:48 pm
by cmgee67
Your correct. I just read about that. It will have never had a stock attached so it wouldn't be considered a rifle anyway. And if it's an Other on the paper work it wouldn't matter what you turned it into. So I know I'll be good to go and I'll be able to make an awesome pistol :)
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 7:05 pm
by Skiprr
cmgee67 wrote:It will have never had a stock attached so it wouldn't be considered a rifle anyway. And if it's an Other on the paper work it wouldn't matter what you turned it into. So I know I'll be good to go and I'll be able to make an awesome pistol :)
Re: AR pistol build help
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:17 pm
by MadMonkey
As far as the buffer tube, I prefer a regular carbine buffer tube with a CAA or MFT (personally prefer the former) saddle on it. Much more comfortable to shoot; it feels like the top half of a SOPMOD stock.