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I have watched it a few times. I catch myself screaming, don't say a word as the cops trick people into incriminating themselves.WTR wrote: Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:54 am I think everyone should watch either “COPs” or “Live PD“ occasionally. It really opens your eyes as to what an Officer will say to reassure you and “”hook” you up in the next second. They are not you buddy. ( this really opened my wife’s “ Polly Anna “ eyes. Many of the arrests on these shows must be thrown out for illegal searches.
Since the first two links in that thread are dead now, I am going to guess that they went to a talk by Prof James Duane and a talk by a police investigator George Bruch from Virginia Beach PD. If so, the whole thing is below:03Lightningrocks wrote: Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:42 am I found the thread that has the links. The vids are long but well worth watching. One never knows when they will be in a bad situation after using deadly force.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=17747&p=201960&hili ... ps#p201886
Charles Cotton follows up with a post stating that this is very similar to what Charles presents in his deadly force seminar (at least in 2008).Elvis wrote: Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:47 am LEO here, not an attorney, if I may give you some food for thought. Perhaps one day you find yourself in a position to have to defend yourself with a firearm and you survive. The Police arrive and survey the scene and find you with a smoking gun in your hand and another person down with a gun shot. Newsflash, you have committed a crime in the State of Texas (Agg. Assault or Murder). If the first words out of your mouth are “I want my attorney” then you will be going to jail and booked. I am sure your attorney will be pleased that you did not “incriminate” yourself and he can then formulate a defense that fits the evidence, as long as your checks clear. Juries tend to take a dim view of defendants that “Lawyer Up” as they appear guilty and uncooperative as if they were hiding something.
Try this instead. If you were in a self defense shooting and LEO arrives and asks you what happened, tell them in general terms what the sequence of events were. Give them something to start the investigation toward a Justified shoot. Do not immediately give details like how many shots were fired by you or what words were exchanged. Tell the Police that you do not want to give a formal statement until you have a chance to contact your attorney and by all means contact you attorney as soon as possible. The Police will be able to take your statement in a day or two after you have calmed down and you will remember the events better. At least give us a chance to send you home to your family if things are looking good for you. The standard “I was in fear of my safety and had to shoot to defend myself” or “I was attacked and shot in self defense” will go in the initial report along with the Officers observations of your behavior and mindset.
Just an opinion from someone that has been to more than a few scenes…
Yes. Thank You. I was having to do some work and did not check links.ELB wrote: Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:13 pmSince the first two links in that thread are dead now, I am going to guess that they went to a talk by Prof James Duane and a talk by a police investigator George Bruch from Virginia Beach PD. If so, the whole thing is below:03Lightningrocks wrote: Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:42 am I found the thread that has the links. The vids are long but well worth watching. One never knows when they will be in a bad situation after using deadly force.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=17747&p=201960&hili ... ps#p201886
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
Prof Duane has no doubt handled or consulted on a lot of cases where someone spoke to the police in the aftermath of a crime and had his words used against him in a subsequent prosecution.
What Prof Duane has NOT handled are cases -- in particular self-defense cases -- where someone spoke to the police in the aftermath of a crime and was NOT arrested and NOT prosecuted and in fact never needed a lawyer. How many are there? Dunno, but a significant number of the SD cases we put into the Self-Defense forum seem to fall into this category.
In the same thread Lighteningrocks posted above, there is this post from Elvis:
Charles Cotton follows up with a post stating that this is very similar to what Charles presents in his deadly force seminar (at least in 2008).Elvis wrote: Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:47 am LEO here, not an attorney, if I may give you some food for thought. Perhaps one day you find yourself in a position to have to defend yourself with a firearm and you survive. The Police arrive and survey the scene and find you with a smoking gun in your hand and another person down with a gun shot. Newsflash, you have committed a crime in the State of Texas (Agg. Assault or Murder). If the first words out of your mouth are “I want my attorney” then you will be going to jail and booked. I am sure your attorney will be pleased that you did not “incriminate” yourself and he can then formulate a defense that fits the evidence, as long as your checks clear. Juries tend to take a dim view of defendants that “Lawyer Up” as they appear guilty and uncooperative as if they were hiding something.
Try this instead. If you were in a self defense shooting and LEO arrives and asks you what happened, tell them in general terms what the sequence of events were. Give them something to start the investigation toward a Justified shoot. Do not immediately give details like how many shots were fired by you or what words were exchanged. Tell the Police that you do not want to give a formal statement until you have a chance to contact your attorney and by all means contact you attorney as soon as possible. The Police will be able to take your statement in a day or two after you have calmed down and you will remember the events better. At least give us a chance to send you home to your family if things are looking good for you. The standard “I was in fear of my safety and had to shoot to defend myself” or “I was attacked and shot in self defense” will go in the initial report along with the Officers observations of your behavior and mindset.
Just an opinion from someone that has been to more than a few scenes…
John Farnam, a longtime SD trainer and police officer, presents very similar information in his courses.
Mr. Stephens (the former security guard acquitted of murder) may have been well served to have some of this information prior to his encounter.
Actually, the article said the jury deliberated three hours on Thursday, and then came back for another 15 minutes on Friday before deciding a verdict.ELB wrote: Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:57 am Going only from the info presented in the link:
1. I tend to think that since the jury needed only 15 minutes to decide that the prosecution case was awful weak. As in, it should not have been brought to court.