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The two were shot and killed by Joe Horn, a Pasadena man who thought they were burglarizing his neighbor’s home last month.

Well...They weren't there for tea...

I really like how the media is purposefully dumbing down Mr. Horn, making him look like some sort of idiot...

And the same media is absolutely reluctant to have to balance the incident by having to tell the tale of these illegal aliens and their criminal past...

Quannel is going to be the front man for all of this till the GJ gets back with a decision on Mr. Horn...

If Mr. Horn is no-billed, I can guarantee you that the national race-baiters will jump in real quick as soon as that happens...

Thats why it is so important that the folks in that nieghborhood get some sort of legal protection from assemblies of any kind, for or against Mr. Horn...The media is continuing to state that it is unlikely they will get some sort of legal protection like that...I believe the media wants to set up the potential unrest that may occur if Mr. Horn is no-billed...

I do not see any good coming from this at all...Hopefully cooler heads will prevail, but I get the feeling thats not what Quannel the tenths minions and the news media want...And they are getting tons of attention while the people in that neighborhood are not...

Photoman wrote:

SC1903A3 wrote:The New Black Panthers went to Mr. Horns neighborhood on Sunday to protest his shooting the two burglars.

I find it interesting that they say Horn is judge, jury and executioner and then in the same sentence say that Horn is guilty of a crime.

Ironic or hypocritical...Pick one...

Stupid wrote:Taking things into its context...

"Don't go outside the house," the 911 operator pleaded. "You're gonna get yourself shot if you go outside that house with a gun. I don't care what you think."

"You wanna make a bet?" Horn answered. "I'm gonna kill 'em."

I believe the dispatcher inadvertantly challenged Mr. Horn into doing exactly the opposite of what he eventually did...

Mr. Horn sounds like a very "proud" man...And challenging a person in this particular frame of mind will generate opposite effects to instruction from someone in this capacity...

There were mistakes made on both sides of this incident, and there were some things that didn' need to be said...

I see off-setting penalties on this deal the more I look at it, and still two people lost their lives because of those mistakes...Not that I am condoning or supporting the "still" un-released data on the deceased as to their status and criminal background if any...And not that any of that information is grounds for the use of deadly force on them at all...

Just more of what I'm thinking about in regards to this case...

cxm wrote:This brings to mind something Chas Cotton said that I use in every CHL class I teach....

"DON'T LET YOUR MOUTH TURN A GOOD SHOOTING BAD."

Boy, are you going to get a bill for this one!

DoubleActionCHL wrote:

frankie_the_yankee wrote:If they ran away, I personally would not have shot them. If they ran towards him, shooting them would be much easier to justify.

The fact that they were both shot in the chest should give us some clues as to which way they were 'running'.[/quote

Bingo!

Doug.38PR wrote:What's Quannell X doing nosing around there? I thought the goons that were killed were Hispanic (one was Puerto Rican or Cuban I think). Or is he now demanding "equal opportunity" for all gutter trash, regardless of race? Well, regardless, he's in good company as he is nothing more than a lowlife himself:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quannell_X

I remember seeing him shove down an old man on the news years ago with two armed goons with AR-15s standing at his sides

Yep, a pillar of society...(sarcasm mode off)

He is nothing without his entourage though...

But then again his involvement is nothing more than an annoyance to that neighborhood and to this incident...He has nothing to offer that will resolve anything with this case...

The local news this morning had a short bit that focused on our buddy Quannel X getting his weekly dose of attention...

Him and his ilk stood in front of Mr. Horns house and had a press conference basically wondering where the investigation and proceedings were going???

They know exactly what is going on, and they obviously want to flame this up as much as they can...

Pathetic!

Ok,

Apparently from what I've seen and heard in many different forums on this incident...That the news media has a few "different" cuts on the 911 tape...

The link to the 911 tape on this thread, I heard the man say that he "DIDN'T" know the neighbors where the burglary was taking place, and that he did know some neighbor across the street from them...

thats what I heard in the link on this thread...

When everything comes out in the wash, I'm sure we'll all be on the same page at that time...

BTW, if you notice that the man went outside, tried to stop the burglars, shot them when they didn'y comply with his instructions and apparently made a threatening advance on him, he then came back inside his house, put the shotgun down, then went back outside where the police "just" showed up...

Whether those were the plainclothes officers, I have not been able to determine that yet...But I seriously doubt that if anyone uniformed or not, would have allowed that shoot to take place...We would certainly know otherwise by now (maybe a little later) if any responding officers had actually witnessed the shooting...

A lot is still up in the air, and I believe our analysis so far, based upon what we know right here in this thread is still pretty good...

I believe we all know this is a messed up deal for everyone involved...

But the good thing about this is that we are all witness to a situation where we all can apply some of the things we know about already, to keep something like this from going bad for one of us, if Heaven forbid, this ever happens to one of us!

The story went national...It's at FoxNews.com in the Top Videos section...

They are saying the "man" was impatient...

Oh well...No one said the ride was going to be smooth...

I had a conversation with some folks at lunch today about this...They brought up the news coverage of this shooting, and asked me what I thought about it...



Ok, I didn't get into it too much other than I thought the man would not be raked over the coals too much...

I do think the media once again has chopped this guy up for shark chum...And the 911 tape has been severely chopped up in the way it has been presented in different media outlets, there are too many differences to mention, in length, and other outright omissions and context alterations...

If there is a jury that can review this, they better bus them in from out of state, because there won;t be anyone available to be able to give an impartial judgment on this in this town...

Venus Pax wrote:

Photoman wrote:I think at this point, with the information we've been given, it's impossible to come to any legal conclusions. It very well could be that both criminals came at him in his front yard. Who knows?

Until then, I'm praying for the guy...

There was a few seconds on the 911 tape where he alluded to the BGs advancing toward him.

I heard that too...

Liberty wrote:

hkmp5s wrote:Well I just heard the 911 call and I think he is screwed. Old chuck the D A is going to go after him Big time. He has been waiting for a test case on our new state gun laws just to show us gun owners who is in charge.

He has? I don't think Chuckie is all that crazy about dragging up that old horse again. He got bit pretty hard and embarrassed, I don't believe he wants the voter reminded about what an idiot he had been. Have you noticed he hasn't been very flaboyant to the press for a while? In the mean time I can't see where this incident has much to do with any of the new gun laws.

I agree...I believe everyone involved is going to be walking on eggshells...

But thats just my take on it at this point...

NAK wrote:NO-billed or not, I feel very sorry for the guy. To be in a position where you feel forced to take human life is bad...to have to listen to that call over and over in the media must be horrible for him.

I agree...

I think he needs an award, we need more folks like that in the country.

I do not agree...Waving a flag and pats on the back are something totally 180 degrees the other way to the sentiments noted above...Yes, a message needs to be sent, and has been, but nobody needs to be trumpeting anything beyond that...

The interview with the neighbor also stickS in my mind.
"I was in shock because I never heard a gunshot before," Hernandez said. With so many people like here, it leaves no doubt as to why the bad guys expect never to be challenged.

Exactly what I was saying last night...

Molon_labe wrote:Listen to his recording...the prosecuting attorney is going to have a field day with this poor man!

Odd thing is..up until he started shooting the 911 guy kinda had a "yah right you won't go out there" egging him on attitude..then it immediately turned into a PUT THE GUN DOWN NOW attitude

I believe it turned into that, but I do not hear anything inciting the man to go outside and NOT listen to the "advice" the dispatcher was giving the man making the call...

And thats just it...The dispatcher was giving "advice", not anything like a "lawful order"...Which is something I do not believe is in their job description or authority...

But thats just me...

Russell wrote:

txinvestigator wrote:

Russell wrote:Wow, very incredible. Notice how as soon as he shot them officers magically appeared?

That's crap.

What? What are you suggesting?

I'm just upset that they didn't get there fast enough, it seemed that it was almost the very moment he had to take matters into his own hands they got there. Horrible luck for the old man

Pasadena P.D. has very good coverage, and some good folks out there working in that regard...

Being familiar with the area where this happened though "might" have been a challenge to get to, even as quickly as they did...Probably just a distance issue...

Obviously the response time is from the time the man made the call and the dispatcher made the call to the officers who could respond to this incident...Looks to me like they did get there as fast as they could...I'm not going to be critical of the response time...Most of them probably responded by coming east on Fairmont to southwest on Red Bluff...Then into that subdivision...

And it didn't appear (hearing on the 911 tape) that they responded with any sirens (audible) running...

So there could be an issue about, that if the man had heard the responding officers approaching he might not have gone outside...

But our LEO contingent here will probably say that they do not want to alert anyone if a crime (like this) is in progress to their approach to the scene...

Just my opinion...