TexasCHLforum.com

kanders wrote:By using "mugger", I was trying to describe a loser who seems to want to get something from me, but has not shown any sort of weapon.

Does he place you in fear of anything that hurts? See 29.02(a)(2) and 1.07(a)(8) above. I wouldn't shoot if the threat was a slap in the face, but I'd certainly be ready for when he finds out that ain't gonna work.

Or even a drunk hothead who comes up to you to start a fight because he thinks I'm flirting with "his woman" or something.

That's where I have a problem with the way the laws are written; why is it justifiable to use LF to prevent a robbery attempt involving less force than an unprovoked assault without the intent of theft? (the "serious bodily injury" requirement under defense of self or third party, vs only "bodily injury" as a part of robbery.)

I guess I still don't understand what constitutes use of force vs. deady force, i.e. if he hits you in the gut with a fist or pushes you to the ground, that doesn't seem "deadly" to me, but where do you draw that line?

It will pretty much always vary; for me, if I'm pushed to the ground, and the assault doesn't stop, I will fear serious injury, whereas I know guys with lots of groundfighting training who would just bring the attacker down with them and show him the error of his ways.

txinvestigator wrote:Yep, now define serious bodily injiry.

I can't even find a definition for "injiry."

In the context of a robbery, however, it doesn't say serious:

Sec. 29.02. Robbery.
(a) A person commits an offense if, in the course of committing theft as defined in Chapter 31 and with intent to obtain or maintain control of the property, he:
(1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly causes bodily injury to another; or
(2) intentionally or knowingly threatens or places another in fear of imminent bodily injury or death.
(b) An offense under this section is a felony of the second degree.

So, bodily injury appears to be:

Texas Penal Code Section 1.07(a)(8)"Bodily injury" means physical pain, illness, or any impairment of physical condition.

Apparently, if it hurts, it's bodily injury.

Serious bodily injury would bump it up to aggravated robbery, of course,

Sec. 29.03. Aggravated Robbery.
(a) A person commits an offense if he commits robbery as defined in Section 29.02, and he:
(1) causes serious bodily injury to another;
(2) uses or exhibits a deadly weapon; or
(3) causes bodily injury to another person or threatens or places another person in fear of imminent bodily injury or death, if the other person is:
(A) 65 years of age or older; or
(B) a disabled person.
(b) An offense under this section is a felony of the first degree.
(c) In this section, "disabled person" means an individual with a mental, physical, or developmental disability who is substantially unable to protect himself from harm.

but the fact that the code specifies both robbery and aggravated robbery as justifications for force, up to and including deadly force, would seem to indicate that the fear need only be of bodily injury, not serious bodily injury, when someone is using it for the purpose of taking something from you.

Of course theft during the night being a justificaiton would also seem to indicate that, at night, there doesn't even need to be a threat.

Any comments from those who get paid to make sense of this stuff? [/quote]