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This is crazy. The guy shooting at gz says that they've had another road rage incident before. What are the chances that 2 people bump into each other on the public roadways unless it is a really small town? The guy must've been stalking gz. He should wear big sunglasses & move to Alaska or Texas.

baldeagle wrote:When I read this story, my first reaction was not again. Then I saw that the guy making the accusation recognized Zimmerman before Zimmerman supposedly did anything. Without knowing any of the details or the motivations, my speculation is that this guy saw a chance to mess with Zimmerman and took it. He's already been accused of threatening behavior with his wife and father-in-law, both of which never resulted in charges. You have to think, given his notoriety that charges would have been filed if there had been any substantive evidence. So this appears to me (again, purely speculating) another case of false charges being flung just to screw up his life a little more. The report says the guy is refusing to press charges. If someone did what he claims Zimmerman did, to you, would you refuse to press charges?

The guy needs to move out of Florida permanently. He has no chance of a quiet life there.

Yep, he should seriously consider moving to Texas.

Fangs wrote:

philip964 wrote:

Fangs wrote:I might have missed it, but haven't seen this story posted yet:
http://www.tmz.com/2013/08/22/george-zi ... -shop-gun/

Shotgun looks awesome. Is it?

My roommate recently got one... I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but it feels awesome to hold. Pumping it is a little weird at first though.

I'm kinda bummed Z didn't stay in Texas.

Funnnnnneee! Ol' Georgie has an endorsement career for Kel-Tec. Mr. Kelgren is a cool dude. I wrote him once with a question/concern about his 2nd amendment stance and he PERSONALLY wrote me back. I felt like he was the real deal, a real defender of the constitution, so I went out and bought a P3AT the next day. It's a great little BUG for winter and a great primary carry in the summer.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/loc ... 9930.story

If this doesn't define him as the good guy and not the bad guy, I don't know what will!

At work, NONE of the African American employees are undecided or pro Zimmerman. ALL of them think that Zimmerman is a racist. When I point out that Zimmerman's great grandfather is African American, they tell me that doesn't matter because Zimmerman is not "black enough". I don't know about you, but THAT is a racist comment when you only look at the person's skin color and base your judgement of a person totally on that.

Charles Barkley, the basketball player said it best in his comment about this whole ordeal has been racialized improperly by the race baiters, "There are racists everywhere. All racism is wrong. There are white racists and BLACK racists." The black racists are showing their true colors. They want to ignore constitutional due process of law of a free country and just hang a guy because he is "not black enough."

Zimmerman is not "black" nor "white" but German, African, and Hispanic American. In another couple of generations of intermarriage, ALL Americans will have skin tone like Zimmerman. The race baiters are increasingly becoming irrelevant. For example, Tiger Woods will become mad at you if you call him "black" because it is RACIST. He will remind you that he is African American and Asian American.

It is a sad day when the prezident of the United States doesn't do his job and try to bring different groups of people together, when the prezident is not a uniter but a divider, race baiting for political gain. Very sad indeed....

Prosecutor had a freudian slip, "Is the defendant allowed to defend
himself?... I mean, Is the victim allowed to defend himself?"

Also, the US government records ALL phone conversations. This means that DeDe's conversation with Trayvon and Zimmerman's conversation with 911 are both recorded. Using computer audio analysis of the TWO recordings (you cannot do this with only one recording), you could also compute the EXACT location of both Trayvon and Zimmerman during the recordings. This means that you could definitively prove which party snuck up on the other party. A REALLY GOOD attorney would've been able to get his/her hands on the DeDe recording with Trayvon with some sort of legal motion or search warrant.

On an interview on CNN, a FBI agent admitted that all phone conversations are recorded, http://vigilantcitizen.com/latestnews/f ... -recorded/

The fact is, the government is selectively WITHOLDING evidence.

P.S. all those who say people like me are paranoid are forgetting that America is the greatest country on earth and America has almost UNLIMITED RESOURCES. America has more gold than South Africa http://qz.com/83396/1-billion-of-gold-h ... this-year/ America has more oil than Saudi Arabia http://rense.com/general9/alask.htm During world war II, some German scientists were interviewed about the atom bomb. They said that they felt it would be impossible to build because it would require the mobilization of the resources of an entire country to build it. America has more resources than entire continents. I think (not a fact, but just an opinion) that the government is delaying tapping into these vast resources that our nation possesses because these are limited resources on planet earth. The strategy is for the rest of the world to use up their resources first so that we'd have the rest of the world by the you-know-what and dominate the planet. In March 2013, USA produced more oil than Saudi Arabia: http://www.aei-ideas.org/2013/07/no-1-u ... -combined/

Using computer algorithms that the FBI and homeland security uses to analyze voice data, 2 seconds is more than enough screaming to positiviely identify the screamer. All you need is 93 milliseconds, which is only 0.093 seconds. Here is the scientific article to back this up:
http://www.ee.columbia.edu/~dpwe/papers ... -pitch.pdf

... we applied a comb-notch filtering method to sep-
arate two Finnish vowels /a/ and /i/ from a mixed voice signal. The
length of the analyzed segment was 93 ms...

Zimmerman could not afford a world class voice analyst as an expert witness. Zimmerman could not afford a competent attorney (read my post about the "knock knock" joke he told). Zimmerman has a "dream team". His team is sleeping on the job!

SlowDave wrote:

drjoker wrote:Zimmerman is going to jail. He cannot afford expert witness for voice print Analysts. Instead, they're playing he said she said. Zimmerman's mom says screamer on 911 recording is zimmerman while trayvon's mom says it sounds like trayvon. I can't believe that gov't w unlimited resources overlooks voice print analysis. Their analysis probably says screamer is zimmerman so they hid evidence from the defense. This is lynching n railroading.

They said there is like 2 seconds of the screaming that is not under other peoples' voices on the 911 tape. Experts testified that it was very difficult and inconclusive to determine who was doing the screaming. I believe this was the right decision.

Going to jail? So, they proved to you beyond a reasonable doubt that he was not defending himself in fear for his life? Wow.

That's if the biased for the defense judge would allow this to happen. Crump is not an expert witness used to analyze evidence. Crump is not a character witness. Crump's testimony could be ruled hearsay and disallowed, as with all the other evidence that is advantageous to the defense that has already been disallowed. I certainly hope what you're saying is correct, for justice's sake. I certainly hope that the lawyer for the defense is not an idiot who told a "knock knock" joke during a murder trial.

baldeagle wrote:

philip964 wrote:

baldeagle wrote:

mojo84 wrote:

bizarrenormality wrote:

mojo84 wrote:Trayvon's dad on the stand now. Should be interesting even though he was not a witness to the incident.

Why would they call him as a witness? It seems like there's very little possible gain and a lot of emotional risk.

Apparently he told the detectives it was not Martin's voice screaming for help on the tape of the call. Kind of an interesting twist actually.

It's more than that. His testimony impeached Attorney Crump's sworn affidavit to the court. This places Crump in play as well as the national coverage of "Dee Dee's phone call and the details of the call and how they were obtained. It's huge for the defense. They have scored a lot of points throughout the trial, but this may be the penultimate.

Sorry could you explain further. I'm lost as usual.

OK.

Ben Crump is one of the attorney's who started the national outrage about race in this case. He is the attorney for the Martin family. When Tracy Martin found "Dee Dee's" phone number on Trayvon's phone and realized that he might have been talking to her at the time he was shot and killed, he turned the phone number over to Crump instead of the police. Crump then contacted "Dee Dee" (her real name is Rachel Jeantel) and arranged to interview her. He recorded parts of the interview and testified under oath that nothing "substantive" was discussed when the recorder was turned off. Unfortunately for him, he forgot that he had invited Matt Guttman of ABC to attend the interview. (Guttman, you may recall, had much of the "breaking" news that escalated the story to a national level - obviously being fed to him directly by the Crump team.) ABC recorded the ENTIRE session, including the parts that Crump claimed were inconsequential. Crump also testified under oath (in the same sworn affidavit) that Tracy Martin had told him that he told the police he wasn't sure that the voice screaming on the 911 tape was his son. Crump also testified that after Tracey had listened to a "cleaned up" version of the call he identified the voice as his sons. All of this was under oath.

The story that went out in the national news was:

Police lied Friday, Crump said, when they said Tracy Martin said the voice crying for help was not his son. What Tracy Martin told police, Crump said, was that "he couldn't tell, that it was too distorted."

The audio has since been cleaned up, and now Tracy Martin has no doubt but that the voice is his son, Crump said.

Today, Detectives Serino and Singleton both testified that, when asked if the voice was his son's, Tracy Martin said no. Tracy, today, equivocated on the stand. However, he testified that he never told Crump that he had told the police he wasn't sure because the tape was too distorted, and he never listened to a "cleaned up" version of the tape. This means, based on sworn testimony, Crump lied under oath. Not only that, but the ABC tape (subpoenaed by the defense) revealed that not only had Crump spoken about substantive issues during the unrecorded portion of his tape (also lied to under oath) but he had coached Jeantel to tell the story he wanted.

So now, if the judge allows it, Crump will have to testify under oath in open court with two tapes entered into evidence, his and ABC's that clearly show that he lied under oath in his affidavit. That means Jeantel's lies and obvious coaching will be heard and seen by the jury as well. If the defense is allowed to question Crump's motives as well, that will bring in the entire scheme to make the case about race and force the state to prosecute. When counterbalanced by Zimmerman's consistency, the obvious quality of the witnesses who support his story and the evidence showing that he acted in self defense (and nothing showing that he didn't), this would destroy whatever credibility that the prosecution has left and the case will crumble.

SlowDave wrote:

drjoker wrote:Zimmerman is going to jail. He cannot afford expert witness for voice print Analysts. Instead, they're playing he said she said. Zimmerman's mom says screamer on 911 recording is zimmerman while trayvon's mom says it sounds like trayvon. I can't believe that gov't w unlimited resources overlooks voice print analysis. Their analysis probably says screamer is zimmerman so they hid evidence from the defense. This is lynching n railroading.

They said there is like 2 seconds of the screaming that is not under other peoples' voices on the 911 tape. Experts testified that it was very difficult and inconclusive to determine who was doing the screaming. I believe this was the right decision.

Going to jail? So, they proved to you beyond a reasonable doubt that he was not defending himself in fear for his life? Wow.

You and I are NOT sequestered jury. If you're following the case, you'll remember that some evidence that was advantageous to Zimmerman was disallowed. Also, some other evidence was asked by the judge to the jury for the jury NOT to consider as part of the body of evidence used to make their judgement. Using ONLY the evidence that the jury is supposed to consider, the case is going in favor of the prosecution.

Zimmerman is going to jail. He cannot afford expert witness for voice print Analysts. Instead, they're playing he said she said. Zimmerman's mom says screamer on 911 recording is zimmerman while trayvon's mom says it sounds like trayvon. I can't believe that gov't w unlimited resources overlooks voice print analysis. Their analysis probably says screamer is zimmerman so they hid evidence from the defense. This is lynching n railroading.

Just saw on TV the other day, Zimmerman's lawyer cracking a "knock, knock" joke IN COURT, "Knock, knock. Who's there? Zimmerman," I was so disgusted at this idiot lawyer I turned off the TV at this point. With a drooling mentally challenged lawyer like that, Zimmerman is definitely gonna fry.

Beiruty wrote:Lynching mob attacks started: http://www.toledoblade.com/Police-Fire/ ... oledo.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Always be ready.

Wow, boys yelled "Kill that white man," while kicking him and the guy being kicked had to defend himself and prove that the VICTIM is not a racist?! It's pretty sad comment on the public idiot, I mean school system that a 78 year old pacifist who was against the Vietnam war has finally lost his naivete and is getting a CHL,

But now, Mr. Watts says he plans to buy a gun and obtain a permit to carry it. "What happened to me … down here on the corner, that changed my perspective on humanity," Mr. Watts said.

You know, racism is racism and the excuses that people have for being racist are just that, excuses. The lamest excuse is the one that is in vogue these days, "No matter what the oppressed do, it cannot be labelled racist because they are the oppressed." I heard Louis Farrakhan say this in a live speech once in Austin.

One of the many reasons why I'm a conservative Republican is because of Ronald Reagan, "I don’t care if every seat is filled by an Asian if they’ve earned the right to be there.” That says a lot. The American dream is not entitlements, welfare, and affirmative action. That would be Socialism and Communism. The American dream is keeping what you earn and hard work. Just because the Cold War is over doesn't mean that the ideological culture war is over.

The Annoyed Man wrote:NBC deliberately altered 911 recording for airplay to make Zimmerman sound like a racist!

This is intolerable!

That's not the first time that NBC fabricated a "crime" where there was none. Remember the NBC dateline "to catch a predator" series with Chris Hansen? Those "child molesters" were monsters to be sure, BUT they have committed no crime. The "child" they had a "date" with was actually an adult actress. So, where's the crime?

Therefore, I'm proud to live in North Texas where Collin County Assistant District Attorney Greg Davis said the cases in Collin County were dropped after NBC dateline's "perverted justice" team failed to provide enough usable evidence. Sloppy police with zero regard for constitutional rights will work with the NBC dateline team while real police will find real evidence before arresting anyone. Hey, maybe that's why Collin County has one of the lowest crime rate in the nation!

God bless Texas!

LIberals are unnecessarily trying to "change the law" to fix something that doesn't need fixing. Mr Zimmerman was arrested and questioned. The evidence seemed to point towards self-defense but is murky, so they let him go, but the police does say that they will be turning his file over to a grand jury to decide because it is not a clear case of self defense. That doesn't look like racism on the part of the police department at all. It looks like that cops did an O.K. job here. They didn't do a stellar job because they did not test Mr. Zimmerman for drugs. Did they even ask Mr. Zimmerman if they could do a drug test?

Although most CHLers are a cut above most folks due to having to pass a rigorous background check, as long as you have human beings, you're gonna have stupid people do stupid stuff. There are stupid drivers on the road driving. Do we ban cars? No. And so neither should we "license" neighborhood watches or make the self-defense laws favor thugs.

It seems like this is a case of two stupid people meeting up. Zimmerman for following Martin who has committed no crime and Martin for beating up a guy that also has committed no crime. It's legal to wear a hoodie and walk around the neighborhood. It's legal to follow someone on the street. It's stupid and illegal to beat someone up just because they're following you. It's stupid and illegal to shoot someone after you've provoked it by following a "suspicious person" after the police told you not to. Although justified in shooting Martin, he did cause the situation where he had to shoot him, so unless he resurrects Johnny Cochran, he'll probably do 5 years for involuntary manslaughter.

It seems like, although stupid, Mr. Zimmerman is the only good neighbor there. There were SIX witnesses who called 911, but NOBODY went outside to help them! Hosing them both down with a garden hose or some pepper spray should stop the stupidity. I've used the garden hose trick with dogs successfully, so it should work with humans who have the I.Q. of dogs. If the situation were reversed, Mr. Zimmerman would've tried to help his neighbors. Unfortunately, this "neighborhood watch" only consisted of Mr. Zimmerman.

I had a very similar situation before where I was walking my dog at 3 a.m. in the morning (my dog is old and has little control of his bowels and bladder) when I heard the "click" of someone stepping on a pebble behind me. I greeted him (I forgot what my exact words were because this was years ago) and he said something like, "Sorry I snuck up on you. I was just leaving the neighborhood." The guy had a backpack on. Sure, that was real suspicious, but walking with a backpack is not illegal. I did not follow him and he did not attack me but just left my neighborhood. I had my hand on my gun in my pocket, but I did not draw because he was not doing anything illegal. Neither of us did anything stupid so everybody came out alive.

P.S. That's the advantage of a "mouse gun". I know everybody disapproves of .22 and .380 for self-defense and approves of .45 or .40, but if you have a big gun, going for the gun means that you'll have to escalate the situation by letting the other guy know you have a gun. Reaching inside your waistband or brushing aside your jacket to reach your gun would reveal that you have a gun. However, putting your hand in your pocket is not obviously going for your gun. Just make sure you smile and act cool when you have your hand in your pocket. Already having your hand on the gun makes the draw much faster. If you have a revolver with a laser sight (or lots of practice), you may even shoot from the hip for maximum speed. Even if you carry a big gun, it's always good to have a mouse gun for a BUG.

It seems like the liberal newsmedia has lied again. The police report clearly states that zimmerman was HANDCUFFED and grilled at the police headquarters. THAT sounds like an arrest to me. Why are the kid's parents DEMANDING that Zimmerman be arrested if he's ALREADY been arrested?

I think that liberals are milking this with a race, anti-2nd A, and anti self defense angle.