Search found 4 matches

by RottenApple
Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:59 am
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.
Replies: 69
Views: 11064

Re: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.

Blandtastic wrote:@3dfxmm: The information I got about the "under control" provision is from the CHL class I took a month ago here in Texas. The police have the right to confiscate the weapon or arrest the owner apparently. I called DPS and they told me the same thing. So, 1815 is legal just to keep the firearm out of reach of passengers and hidden from plain sight. Also it cannot be on your person. In short, I was definitely within the boundaries of the law.

I think the Killeen PD lieutenant was confused about the issue. She did tell me that if the firearm was within reach that she would detain me and possibly arrest me if she felt unsafe. You can beat the charge but you can't beat the ride. That is why I caution anyone from going through Killeen with a handgun concealed under 1815 without a CHL. They apparently feel that they have the right to harrass you for following the law.

As far as telling the officer that I had a weapon in the car, I feel like it is just common courtesy. Better to tell the cops up front and get it out of the way than get arrested when they freak about a gun that you didn't tell them about. I am sympathetic to the stresses involved with their line of work and try to look at it from their point of view.

What I get for being polite I guess.
Clarification: If it is your vehicle or in your control, you can carry a handgun on or about your person provided it is not in plain view, you can legally possess a handgun, you are not a member of a criminal street gang, and you are not engaged in a criminal act. There is nothing in the MPA that prohibits you from wearing your gun in a holster (or even tucked into your pants - though this is just asking for trouble).

HB1815 - Motorist Protection Act
SECTION 1. Section 46.02, Penal Code, is amended by
amending Subsection (a) and adding Subsections (a-1) and (a-2) to
read as follows:
(a) A person commits an offense if the person [he]
intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or
her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the
person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle
that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person
intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or
her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person
or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a
Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm;
or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as
defined by Section 71.01.
(a-2) For purposes of this section, "premises" includes
real property and a recreational vehicle that is being used as
living quarters, regardless of whether that use is temporary or
permanent. In this subsection, "recreational vehicle" means a motor
vehicle primarily designed as temporary living quarters or a
vehicle that contains temporary living quarters and is designed to
be towed by a motor vehicle. The term includes a travel trailer,
camping trailer, truck camper, motor home, and horse trailer with
living quarters.
Now, carrying on body under MPA could be problematic if an officer requests you to exit your vehicle because then you would be carrying w/o a license (assuming you don't have a CHL). So it's probably not a smart idea, but it certainly isn't illegal. Should someone be carrying on body under MPA (w/o a CHL), get pulled over and asked to exit the vehicle, I would think it smart to inform the officer that I was carrying a handgun Nader authority of the MPA, that it was on my person, that i was concerned i would violate MPA by exiting the vehicle, and ask the officer how they would like me to proceed. This lets the officer know 1) you are carrying legally (they may disagree as happened in your case), 2) you are being responsible and don't want to surprise them, & 3) you are willing to comply with their directions.
by RottenApple
Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:45 am
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.
Replies: 69
Views: 11064

Re: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.

Blandtastic wrote:As for the arguing, well he did drop the matter pretty quickly when I called his bluff on the arrest. I wasn't rude but I will politely, firmly reject anyone shredding my Constitutional rights. I lived for 10 years with them gone while serving in the military and do not appreciate someone trying to abrogate my 4th Amendment rights because he is having a bad day or whatever. He was wrong and he knew it. He just wanted to intimidate me. Uncool.

Sorry, not trying for snark here. I am still a little irritated about the incident. It's hard to describe his attitude but he was way out of line.
I'm sure he was out of line, but I think you got pretty lucky that he dropped the issue. LEOs aren't paid to know the law, they are paid to enforce it. There are so many laws n the books, not to mention the amended sections, gray issues, etc, that its impossible for anyone, including lawyers & judges to know the entirety of the law. That's why there are law libraries where attorneys & lawyers can look up laws, statutes, cases, etc. Heck, just look at the number of posts on this forum where people have been told by LEOs, DAs, etc that its illegal to carry in hospitals, even if its not posted.

All I'm saying is that it is a better policy (IMO) to back down temporarily and file a formal complaint later. If this officer had wanted to, he could have arrested you, given you a free ride to the local PD, charged & booked you, and you would have had to she'll out the $$$ for an attorney to fight it. You'd probably win in the end, but you'd be out lots of cash to get there.

Just something to think about. We each have our own way of dealing with these types of encounters. And, as always, our methods change based upon our knowledge and experience. It's the old folks on this forum (Charles, Jallan, Pawpaw, TAM, AndyC, and others) that have taught me a lot about dispute resolution and especially dealing with LEOs.
by RottenApple
Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:14 am
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.
Replies: 69
Views: 11064

Re: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.

I just re-read my post and realized it may sound like an attack towards you or your experience. It was not intended that way and, if you took it that way, I apologize.

You were legally in the right, of course. I'm just a firm believer in not arguing/disagreeing with LEOs unless absolutely necessary. In this case, a simple "thank you for the clarification, officer" might have diffused a potentially disastrous encounter. Then just file a complaint with the department after the fact.
by RottenApple
Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:47 am
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.
Replies: 69
Views: 11064

Re: Do not go into Killeen. You will be sorry.

Welcome to the forum. :tiphat:

I've got to say that this is an interesting first post. I've been through Killeen many times, and been pulled over there once (burnt out taillight) and never had any issues. When I got pulled over I handed my DL, CHL, & insurance card to the officer, he asked if I was carrying (I was), where it was (right hip, about 3:00), and to keep away from it. Then he told me about the taillight. He was pleasantly surprised when I thanked him & offered to replace it right then (I carry spare bulbs & fuses - a leftover from when I drove truck). He watched while I replaced it, wrote me a warning, and I went on my way to get my nieces in Granite Shoals.

Now, one experience (yours or mine) with a single officer doesn't mean a department-wide policy nor a general attitude issue with KPD officers, but it seems to me that your attitude (based on your description of the event) and disagreement (again, based on your post) with the officer may have caused things to be more difficult than they needed to be otherwise.

Just my 2¢.

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