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goose wrote:

rotor wrote:Goose

But you are trusting them with your personal information. Or do you expect to get their information, but they get none of yours? If you are giving them your information, you are trusting them with the holy grail. As others have said, you are trusting that they won't want to come to your house uninvited to check if you have more guns; You are trusting that with your information they don't sell it to someone looking to get a credit card in your name. I have never heard of a person going to jail for a sold firearm later used in a crime.

If you are taking information but giving none, your model works I suppose.

Forget that this is a gun transaction. Let's say you are selling or buying anything else of value. Would you not want a bill of sale? If not that is your business. As far as going to jail for a sold firearm later used in a crime, happens all the time with straw purchases. Yesterday was on the news as a matter of fact woman (girlfriend) bought an AK and a handgun for felon boyfriend and he killed a bunch of people and she faces 10 years. Not that a BOS would have mattered but transfer of a gun to someone that shouldn't have it can put you in jail. This topic though has been beaten to death and I respect all the people that don't want to provide BOS and my feeling is that I want a BOS and that's how I do business. Not every sale goes through. No big deal.

But your example is invalid for the point either of us are making. The seller did not go to jail. The girlfriend that was violating the law went to jail. The seller wasn't protected from anything because the seller wasn't doing anything wrong. You even say that the BOS wouldn't have mattered. I'm not here to beat you up. I am here to encourage you to not give your address and information to someone who could use it against you. And yes, I buy things at flea markets and swap meets and gun shows all of the time. Very rarely am I given a BOS. I cant remember the last time I asked for one for a used item. Again, just encouraging you or anyone reading along to not give out personal information. At a bare minimum give out a PO Box and no DL#.

rotor wrote:Goose

But you are trusting them with your personal information. Or do you expect to get their information, but they get none of yours? If you are giving them your information, you are trusting them with the holy grail. As others have said, you are trusting that they won't want to come to your house uninvited to check if you have more guns; You are trusting that with your information they don't sell it to someone looking to get a credit card in your name. I have never heard of a person going to jail for a sold firearm later used in a crime.

If you are taking information but giving none, your model works I suppose.

Forget that this is a gun transaction. Let's say you are selling or buying anything else of value. Would you not want a bill of sale? If not that is your business. As far as going to jail for a sold firearm later used in a crime, happens all the time with straw purchases. Yesterday was on the news as a matter of fact woman (girlfriend) bought an AK and a handgun for felon boyfriend and he killed a bunch of people and she faces 10 years. Not that a BOS would have mattered but transfer of a gun to someone that shouldn't have it can put you in jail. This topic though has been beaten to death and I respect all the people that don't want to provide BOS and my feeling is that I want a BOS and that's how I do business. Not every sale goes through. No big deal.

rotor wrote:

glock27 wrote:So lets take guns out of the picture...
What if you sold a few wrenches and hammers to someone on craigslist, would you still ask for their info? It could cya if they intended on using it in a crime.

Or if i buy a baseball bat at a sporting goods store and pay cash. Should they be allowed to get my info in case the bat was used in another manner to cover themselves?

Or if i buy some rope bleach ductape kerosene plastic sheeting and a few shovels at hardware store and pay cash should the store feel obligated to get my info? Why does anyones CYA nees to be covered if you had nothing to do with the crime or intent of it that was commited if one ever did occur?

I think the whole collecting info is bogus it leads to profiling, and it appears that there are sone hypocrytical ways of thinking floating around. Slippery slope as someone said. Anyones personal opinion on someone shouldnt be a reason for the to refuse sale. Imho

Let's not be ridiculous. Wrenches, no I would not get a bill of sale. How about livestock? Would you buy some cattle from a stranger without a bill of sale? Remember that it is illegal to sell a firearm to someone that you know is not legally allowed to own it. I don't believe wrenches fit into that category. Most firearms are expensive and the idea of a paper trail to my thinking is a good idea. I wouldn't buy a diamond ring from a stranger either without a paper trail. As I said though, you do what ever you want to do when buying or selling a firearm. I won't buy or sell to someone that won't fill out a bill of sale and they know it in advance. That's my option and that's how I do business. You can do it anyway you want.
I don't see how filling out a BOS is "profiling". And yes, if a guy came in with swastikas on his forehead and love hate symbols tattooed on his hands my personal opinion would be to not sell to him even with a bill of sale.
I am also very weary about these sales. I never go alone. My wife usually is with me and has a weapon on the ready. Remember, significant cash is about to transpire here so caution is the name of the game. Recent shooting and theft at a local gun store and the owner has just now been able to get back to work. About 25 years ago a gun shop owner was murdered in my city and police have never found killer. Be extra careful on these type of sales. As I said, I trust nobody.