Senate passes bill to delay digital TV switch

[agbullet2k1]

That's very interesting there, Mr. 72, but you miss the point. People should buy their own converter box or whatever it is out of their own money that they earned for themselves at their own jobs instead of expecting their masters in Washington to buy one for them out of my money.

Yeah but my point is, why have a beef about the $40 thing while we willingly let them do many thousands of times worse things to us over and over?

I may not want to pay for your converter box with my taxes, but there's a lot more that I don't want to pay for but it's all hidden somewhere and it's far worse, I guarantee you. This is like a magician's trick of misdirection. See we all get in a tizzy over this $40 converter box. While everyone's looking at that, let's do this "Economic Stimulus" pork-o-rama package and nobody will notice that we just paid more to re-sod the mall in D.C. alone than the cost of all of the converter boxes.

At least with the converter box, we have something to show for it.

I for one am particularly fond of the part of the "stimulus" increasing the new home buyer credit to $15k with no requirement to repay, seeing as how I'm a few weeks from closing on my first home. The rest of the porkfest can die in a fire.

[mr.72]

I for one am particularly fond of the part of the "stimulus" increasing the new home buyer credit to $15k with no requirement to repay, seeing as how I'm a few weeks from closing on my first home. The rest of the porkfest can die in a fire.

Well everyone is in favor of pork that benefits only them.

Pay for your own house! If you want the government to pay for your housing, move to China.

[agbullet2k1]

I for one am particularly fond of the part of the "stimulus" increasing the new home buyer credit to $15k with no requirement to repay, seeing as how I'm a few weeks from closing on my first home. The rest of the porkfest can die in a fire.

Well everyone is in favor of pork that benefits only them.

Pay for your own house! If you want the government to pay for your housing, move to China.

I don't see anything different in the tax credit than writing off charitable donations or the interest paid on a mortgage or a new child or business expenses, etc. Where I have issues with this bill (apart from its very existence) are with projects that don't do anything related to the stated purpose of the bill, such as AIDS research or after school programs. I'm not seeing how those things inspire people to invest or buy. However, tax credits will encourage people to invest or buy. Of course, I'd rather just pay less taxes in the first place and not bother with rebates and credits and such.

In my case, I'm upholding my end of the deal by throwing the money back out into the economy by way of buying appliances, furniture, hiring labor for installing flooring, etc.

But yes, you are correct in that everyone favors things that benefit themselves, so YMMV.

[mr.72]

I don't see anything different in the tax credit than writing off charitable donations or the interest paid on a mortgage or a new child or business expenses, etc.

The difference is that you actually PAID taxes when you get a write-off for interest or child or business expenses. But with a tax credit, you didn't even PAY that tax.

So if this was a $15,000 tax deduction if you buy a house [not first-time, or new, but for everyone everywhere buying any house for any purpose] then that is fine. That means that in order for you to get the full benefit of this you must be paying more than $15,000 in taxes to begin with. But with a tax credit, you see, I don't buy a new house but my taxes that I actually paid are being put into your pocket. That's income redistribution plain and simple.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, you can always count on the support of Paul.

Pay for your own house. I paid for mine.

[bdickens]

That's very interesting there, Mr. 72, but you miss the point. People should buy their own converter box or whatever it is out of their own money that they earned for themselves at their own jobs instead of expecting their masters in Washington to buy one for them out of my money.

Yeah but my point is, why have a beef about the $40 thing while we willingly let them do many thousands of times worse things to us over and over?

I may not want to pay for your converter box with my taxes, but there's a lot more that I don't want to pay for but it's all hidden somewhere and it's far worse, I guarantee you. This is like a magician's trick of misdirection. See we all get in a tizzy over this $40 converter box. While everyone's looking at that, let's do this "Economic Stimulus" pork-o-rama package and nobody will notice that we just paid more to re-sod the mall in D.C. alone than the cost of all of the converter boxes.

At least with the converter box, we have something to show for it.

Actually, I'm in a tizzy about the whole ball of wax. The Federal government is supposed to do two things: defend the country and regulate interstate commerce. It isn't supposed to pay for education, retirement, health care, or any of the myriad other things the taxpayers get robbed to support.

[Bart]

I don't see anything different in the tax credit than writing off charitable donations or the interest paid on a mortgage

They're all examples of middle class Welfare.

The new ruling class distracts the citizens with bread and circuses and the Constitution becomes just a memory.

[kd5zex]

Anyway, if you have a beef with the Feds being involved in licensing the air waves then I guess you have a right to your opinion but this has been this way since the dawn of radio. Otherwise we would have mass chaos and nobody would be able to communicate reliably via radio. There was no business incentive for TV stations to make the switch, and no real incentive for consumers to make the switch, but it was something that we (the people of the USA, represented by our elected officials) deemed necessary on a national level so a FCC rule was required to make it happen. There was no way that TV stations or consumers would make the switch without the law.

First, it depends on your definition of dawn. Marconi had a working transmitter and receiver in 1896 and wireless experimentation had been going on for several years prior. Government started handing out licenses and allocating spectrum around 1927. Semantics yes, but I had to point it out.

Second, you have made a fantastic point here. There was no incentive for broadcasters nor consumers to make the switch. This is / was a HUGE money grab for the FCC, by means of "to the highest bidder". There is a lot more to it other than "public interest concerns" going back into the nineties and the broadcaster vs. cable battles, HDTV, rural broadband, etc., etc. Each potential user of the spectrum had their very own lobbyist some with better connections than others.

The problem that I have with it is the FCC charging for the use of the spectrum.

While RF spectrum is a natural resource it can not be exhausted only saturated, its more like tubing on the river rather than drinking from it or using it for farming. I use the little parts of the spectrum so graciously bestowed upon us commoners by the royalty in the ivory towers almost daily. We too hold a chunk of the more valuable spectrum (VHF and UHF) and once the spectrum is reallocated it will only be a matter of time before the FCC "unallocates" or minimizes our allotment to an extent where only digital communications are allowed because those silly amateur radio operators don't need 4 MHz of spectrum in the VHF band and we could make (insert insane amount of money here) by "allocating" it to (name your favorite wireless provider here).

[Greybeard]

Well, I got tired of waiting on Big Brother to recognize the TV antenna stickin' up behind the range office where some of us poor folks sometimes like to watch the 6:00 news or a maybe a football game. Went to Wally World in Lewisville this week and my buddy David in Sporting Goods, having absolutely no 9mm ammo to sell, helped me pick out a $59 converter box and all the connections for two TVs. $112.00. Another contribution to the "economic stimulus". Like the bumber sticker sez, "Because not everyone can be on welfare."

[boomerang]

If I didn't know better I might think the delay was billiantly subversive.

People were able to watch season finales without buying new equipment. Now we head into a season of pools, vacations and reruns. No need to buy a converter box now.

Add in the sorry state of the big networks. Killing some of the most interesting new shows. Renewing the most derivative new pablum and unfunny sitcoms. Many established shows turning sour or running out of steam. The announced Fall lineups look like they could be even worse, if that's even possible.

No wonder such a large percentage of the $40 coupons expired instead of being redeemed.

[KD5NRH]

People were able to watch season finales without buying new equipment. Now we head into a season of pools, vacations and reruns. No need to buy a converter box now.

But nobody who saw this season's finale of House is going to miss next season's opener.