Brandishing?

[Jacob Staff]

"What if" you are in a situation where you use a firearm for protection, drawing and possible aiming at the bad guy and he leaves. I have always heard that you want to be the first to call the cops.

Should you
a) call 911
b) call the county sheriff's non-emergency line
c) call the city PD (if you know what city you are actually in)
d) call Metro PD if your on a tollway
e) get tired of waiting on hold and take your chances
f) write out a statement for yourself and go about day.

[stevie_d_64]

By drawing on a threat, and that threat retreating upon comprehending what they see as a no-win situation, I would say that is not brandishing...

If having to draw and "not" discharging that weapon in that situation, I would not dial 911...I would instead dial the local jurisdictions "non-emergency" number and state that you would like to file a report of that incident...And if you should come into the office, or wait for a Law Enforcement Officer to arrive to take your report at the scene...

Be aware that you should let them know what the status of the situation is at that time of your call...

Is the situation diffused, has the suspect left the area, etc etc...

Don't just tell them you chased a guy off with a "gun" and just want to tell them about it...You may be hearing sirens coming your way in a matter of seconds...

Take good mental notes and be prepared to give that information to L.E. in a calm, mature manner (if possible)...

Don't relate a story like it came out of a movie...Keep the "gangsta speak" out of it..."Like, I wuz gonna bust a cap in his [expletive deleted], but he ran off like a [expletive deleted]"...

If you have time and the means...Write the information down...Don't write a book, just ask yourself the particulars...Hat? Shirt? Pants or shorts? What color of those items...Body type, hair, eyes, age...etc etc etc...Keep the answers simple, short and accurate...Licence plate number, type/make of car and color, any body damage or special paint styles or decals...

When the Law arrives, make sure your carry piece is secure and back in its little home, and not out in plain view...Thats a quick way to get cuffed and stuffed while they sort it all out for you...

Bottom line, use common sense, and govern yourself accordingly per that situation...

Being observant should become second nature to you...

Later,
Steve

[Charles L. Cotton]

Good post Stevie.

The only place I would differ is that I would make it a 911 call, for two reasons. First, if the BG decides to call 911, fearing you are going to, then his "man with a gun" call is going to drop and the police will be looking for you as the BG. Also, some may think that you weren't actually in fear for your life, or serious bodily injury, if you chose to make a non-emergency call, rather than a 911 call. (Yeah I know, the attorney is me is coming out.)

Secondly, you want to give the LEO's a chance to get the BG, before he does this to someone else.

Regards,
Chas.

[MoJo]

I agree with Charles - - - call 911 immediately! You have to cover yourself before the BG covers his. Along with a gun, second gun, reloads, and flashlight you should never leave home without your phone.

[Chris]

if it's serious enough that you feel the need to exhibit a weapon, then the police need to know ASAP so they can be looking for this person. what if your family is around the corner and this clown decides to target them now?

[stevie_d_64]

What I meant was if you are not familiar with the area, then certainly call "911"...I most cases yes, I would do that, but I guess I am of a mindset (that of course I need to work on a bit) that I do not like stirring up the response actions of the local law, for I situation that I thought was under control...

I am a Volunteer F.F. and I am one of a few qualified cheuffers (engine operator/drivers) in my company...Running emergency traffic is not fun and games, and the risks are high, even with all the lights and sirens to any emergency...

I guess I need to modify my thoughts on that, I may need additional counseling...

Later,
Steve

[txinvestigator]

GREAT replies guys!

I would also like to mention that Texas does not have a Brandishing law.

You can be charged with failing to conceal it, but I believe chapter 9 provides a defense for that.

[jimlongley]

Over in the HS2000 forum there is a young lady who NEEDED to call 911 after she found a maintenance man in her apartment.

He had not announced his presence, she heard a noise and armed herself and confronted him. He claimed he had gotten the wrong apartment.

A half hour later the apartment manager was at her door with a deputy trying to make her out as the BG.

She needed to make the call, even if the guy had what seemed to be a reasonable explanation, partly because the apartment management has gotten aggressive with her, and interestingly also partly because the guy quit right after the incident. Methinks there is an underlying story that we may never know.

[CaptDave]

GREAT replies guys!

I would also like to mention that Texas does not have a Brandishing law.

You can be charged with failing to conceal it, but I believe chapter 9 provides a defense for that.

According to Tx Concealed Hangun Law, PC 9.04:

"The threat of force is justified when the use of force is justified ..."
also "... as long as the actor's purpose is limited to creating an apprehension that he will use deadly force if necessary, does not constitute the use of deadly force".

As far as failing to conceal, the law states an offense is committed if the license holder "intentionally fails to conceal the handgun" while carrying "on or about the license holders person".

[HerbM]

...
If having to draw and "not" discharging that weapon in that situation, I would not dial 911...I would instead dial the local jurisdictions "non-emergency" number and state that you would like to file a report of that incident...
...

I am NOT disagreeing (nor necessarily agreeing that non-emergency is better than 911, but a practical note:

In Austin, dialing the 311 number is worthless as a means to report a non-emergency to the police -- it will just delay the report and eventually connect you to 911 anyway. They really don't seem to mind 911 calls for non-emergencies (not discussing routine inquiries but exigent reports and are below the level of an emergency) and the 311 is ineffective.

If you knew the local phone number for the police that might work, but you would have to go through the process of "creating a report" which 911 can do more effectively with their quick response and automatic recording systems.

They do NOT freak out (in Austin at least) if you call them to report something suspicious that does not rise to the level of an emergency.

I am hoping that it is clear from context that I am not suggesting calling 911 for ordinary inquiries or mundane matters. Typically my calls have been for suspicious people in the neighborhood (possibly fake census worker) and dangerous objects in the road. Of course for minor traffic accidents where no police presence is required -- they give you a reporting number etc.


--
HerbM

Question: Will someone please direct me to the legal sources (laws and definitions) for CHL, brandishing, and the supposed assumption of "deadly force" being used. I have been Googling state and non-state sources for way to long this afternoon.

[speedsix]

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/administra ... edlaws.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Skiprr]

HerbM earns this week's prize for Topic resurrection! Almost six years!

The DPS CHL handbook that speedsix posted covers all the most relevant CHL laws. But if you ever want to search/read through the Texas State Constitution and all of the state's legal statutes, here's the site: http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/.

[G.A. Heath]

Well I guess I can contribute to the zombie thread...

If the situation is bad enough that you have to draw your weapon, then by law it is bad enough to use your weapon. If the situation is bad enough to use deadly force, then logically it follows that it is bad enough to call 911. Remember Weapon drawn = 911 call, if its used or not.

[speedsix]

...if you think this is a "zombie" thread...you've lead a sheltered life...this is a question well worth asking BEFORE it comes up on the street...

[Skiprr]

...if you think this is a "zombie" thread...you've lead a sheltered life...this is a question well worth asking BEFORE it comes up on the street...

G.A. meant "zombie thread" as in "a thread back from the dead," not as in Zombieland. Until HerbM's post yesterday, the last activity in this topic was June 12, 2005.