At Church....and school?

[rmoraes]

B"H
Good day y'all!
Yes, I also carry at my temple, but I ask you the following:
Imagine that at the chrch/temple grounds also there is a school that offer junior to 8th grade during normal hours (8-3PM). Assume you share the building for prayers and classes. 1) Can you carry inside that bldg during school hours? 2) Can you carry at week-end/ out of school hours and main services?

Happy !

[barres]

We've had these sort of discussions before, and the truth is that no one really knows. The law does not define a school, it only prohibits carrying at one. I would say if the school is in any way accredited, you're out of luck, even when school is not in session. The law doesn't say you can't carry on the premises of a school when school is in session. It says you cannot carry on the premises of a school. IANAL, YMMV, IMHO, etc.

[dicion]

We've had these sort of discussions before, and the truth is that no one really knows. The law does not define a school, it only prohibits carrying at one. I would say if the school is in any way accredited, you're out of luck, even when school is not in session. The law doesn't say you can't carry on the premises of a school when school is in session. It says you cannot carry on the premises of a school. IANAL, YMMV, IMHO, etc.

"Premises" Is also defined as 'a building, or part of a building'.

So, if the school is a separate building from the church, I don't see a problem carrying there. Just don't carry it into the school.

Same thing if it's one building used for both. If a separate section of the same building is used as a school, but the church section is, well, used as a church, just do not carry into that other 'part of a building'.

[TDDude]

Uuuhhhh, I thought I read that it was only during school hours or school functions.

I'll have to pull up the ole PDF again to check.

My kids are always at swim meets in the summer and the invitational meets are always in schools. Plus, there are quite a few young churches that rent school property for their services.

I guess I been goin outlaw!

[TxFig]

We've had these sort of discussions before, and the truth is that no one really knows. The law does not define a school, it only prohibits carrying at one. I would say if the school is in any way accredited, you're out of luck, even when school is not in session. The law doesn't say you can't carry on the premises of a school when school is in session. It says you cannot carry on the premises of a school. IANAL, YMMV, IMHO, etc.

This thread was just in time for a question I was about to ask along the same lines... and it really boils down to the same question "What is a school?".


I am on the BoD of a local homeschool support group. In Texas, homeschools are legally defined as "unaccredited private schools". Fyi, the VAST majority of private schools in the state of Texas are unaccredited (accreditation really doesn't mean anything - but that's another thread). Anyway, across the state there are tons of homeschool co-ops, associations, and support groups which get together for various functions. Homeschoolers are not unanimous in much - but one of the things they would almost universally agree with is that "we are NOT a school".

The problem is - many of the things we do LOOK like a school to the uninitiated. A co-op might be a group of a dozen parents who get together and hire a Spanish tutor. They might form a basketball team and play other homeschool teams (or private schools, or perhaps even public schools). Homeschoolers frequently use churches during the week for these functions.


How can we make sure that we avoid being classified as a "school"?

[dicion]

Wear shirts that say 'we are not a school'?

I dunno.. I'm guessing that since you're not an official organization that owns physical property, then you would have no official 'school property' so therefore, could not be a school?

That's my 2c

[howdy]

Another hypothetical........Is "Sunday School" a school?

[Keith B]

Another hypothetical........Is "Sunday School" a school?

IANAL, but the answer is No. Reference is made that for the purpose of a Gun/Drug Free School zone, the definition is in section 481.134 (5) of the Texas Health and Safety Code, which states: "School" means a private or public elementary or secondary school or a day-care center, as defined by Section 42.002 of the Texas Human Resources Code.

Section 42 of the Human Resources Code defines what is really a school and a Sunday school is not accredited, so no, it is not.

[C-dub]

Good afternoon everyone.

I think if the church is a seperate building from the school then we are okay at church. However, if they are attached I think we cannot carry at that church at all. The separation of the church and school based on which section of the building is used for which purpose doesn't apply like it does for governmental meetings. When the children are brought into the church for instruction I think we cannot carry at that time, like a library, because a school event is taking place.

Also, regarding home schools, since the homes are privately owned couldn't the right to carry be determined by the owner of the home?

Could be wrong, but this is how I read the code.

[rkl56119]

Home school is something different.

I think you should err on the side of caution. It's a whole lot cheaper than face a criminal charge and the possibility of losing your license.

[boomerang]

Remember there is an exception for schools ("unless pursuant to written regulations or written authorization of the institution") that may be an easy solution for some of you.

[texas1234]

Yeah this definition stinks.

My Church on Sunday is a Church solely and listed as a Church. Monday through Friday it is a school on the first floor but still a Church on the second floor. There is no school on Sunday but it all happens to be in the same building.


What do yall think?

[Keith B]

Yeah this definition stinks.

My Church on Sunday is a Church solely and listed as a Church. Monday through Friday it is a school on the first floor but still a Church on the second floor. There is no school on Sunday but it all happens to be in the same building.


What do yall think?

It's a church. IANAL though.

[C-dub]

And this is why it stinks.

I, unfortunately, think it is within the premises of a school and would not risk it. I do not wish to nor have the money to be a test case to get this defined.

[TxFig]

Wear shirts that say 'we are not a school'?

I dunno.. I'm guessing that since you're not an official organization that owns physical property, then you would have no official 'school property' so therefore, could not be a school?

Funny you would mention that.... it was actually my reason for bringing this up.

There are some homeschool associations in the state (San Antonio & Houston) that DO own their own property / facility. WE don't own property - yet. We are seriously working on a fund raising program so that we can buy our own property.


We have leased property in that past, and ran into problems with the local fire marshal who said that we had to be held to "the codes that apply to schools". I want to make sure that any facility we might build is not classified as a school from the outset. Allowing CHL holders into the building being one of the primary reasons....


Side note: anyone want to donate about $8 million to our homeschool group?

IANAL, but the answer is No. Reference is made that for the purpose of a Gun/Drug Free School zone, the definition is in section 481.134 (5) of the Texas Health and Safety Code, which states: "School" means a private or public elementary or secondary school or a day-care center, as defined by Section 42.002 of the Texas Human Resources Code.

Section 42 of the Human Resources Code defines what is really a school and a Sunday school is not accredited, so no, it is not.

Hmmm. So if accreditation is the measure section 42 of the Human Resource Code uses to define a school, then UNaccredited private schools (which would include homeschools) would be excluded, no?