Seeking advice- to tell or not

[ex_dsmr]

To those who pose the opinion that he should ask permission...I offer you this thought:

How many would go ask a store/resteraunt owner if they allowed firearms?
If its not posted, its open season. Is that disrespectful to carry in THEIR establishment without asking first?
What about non 30.06 signs that have no legal bearing?

[A-R]

@txdang (post on previous page), but what else do you ask permission to bring before entering someone's home? Where do you draw the line? If someone tells me before entering "please don't bring guns in here" then I will respect that and not do so (and likely not enter at all, but that's a different discussion).

And the smoking analogy is not a good one, IMHO. Sidestream smoke is more dangerous to others in a room than a holstered firearm.

@txdang (post above), I agree there is a distinct difference between open-to-public property and private residence, but if I am INVITED into someone's home, I assume I am invited with all the "baggage" that comes with me. If there is a specific thing you wish me to refrain from doing or bringing into your home, please let me know. But I'm not going to play 20 questions to discover your particular prejudices.

[A-R]

Austinrealtor, I really don't have a good answer for you that wouldn't come off as me being a smartalec. There are limits to everything, and I don't ask permission for everything. However, I do understand that the topic of guns can be a touchy one and this is the point of these postings. I ask (discretely) before I carry into a person's home. That's me. I see it as respecting their home.

The smoking may be a poor analogy, but there are some that would argue that secondhand smoke is not harmful inspite of any evidence that says it is. I'm not one of those, but it's my lame defense. It was the best I came up with when posting my opinion.

Fair enough, I think the only real difference is you see "guns" as a "touchy" subject worthy of always asking permission. I don't always agree that is the case.

For me, it depends on the circumstances. For example, if I KNEW previously that someone was VERY anti-gun, I might offer the courtesy of asking first, with caveat that I may decide not to enter and may leave if they tell me "no guns", especially if leaving my gun in the car would put me in a more dangerous position. If they don't want me having guns, then what security/defense do they offer me while I'm on their property? And would leaving my gun in my car needlessly put my gun at increased risk of theft (for instance, if staying overnight in a "not so good" part of town).

But I have carried undetected DADT into the homes of some people who I know are less than thrilled with the idea of guns. In some ways it's sort of a "what they don't know won't hurt them" decision. But it also goes back to what's more important? My safety or their feelings?

I try my best to always be respectful of others' property, but some amount of pragmatism has to enter the decision-making process as well. For instance, as a Realtor, I enter "other people's homes" all the time. They give me permission to do so and I'm always respectful of their homes, making sure not to track in mud/dirt, taking off my shoes before walking on carpet if requested, and always make certain I turn off lights and lock up before I leave. Should I also make certain it is OK with the home owner that I carry a gun on me in their home? Is this practical? Could it actually INCREASE the risk for me entering their home? Realtors have been KILLED upon entering supposedly "vacant" homes. And I often enter and show/view 10 or 15 homes in a day. Do I need prior permission from all of these home owners to enter their homes? What if they are not present (99% are gone when I enter), do I still need permission? What if the home is owned by an institution like a bank or a trust? From whom do I get permission to carry my gun? What do I do if they deny me permission to carry my gun? Do I not show that particular home to my clients?

I realize the above paragraph may seem to only apply to Realtors, but it raises realistic pragmatic questions. The Texas PC 30.06 provisions were setup very thoughtfully to specifically address these issues by putting onus on the property owner to inform a CHL carrier of the owners' wishes in this matter. And it doesn't have to be a "big ugly sign". A simple oral notice of "please don't bring guns into this home" is sufficicent legally, morally, and ethically and all CHL carriers should abide by such requests. But on the other hand, we should NOT be obligated to go ASKING every property owner if it's OK for us to carry on their property - if for no other reason than it rapidly defeats the purpose of CONCEALED carry if we must constantly let every property owner know we're carrying by asking their permission.

[mgood]

I don't see the disrespect. I wouldn't think of asking permission to wear my gun any more than I'd think of asking permission to wear my watch.
Sure, if someone tells me "No guns," then I'm out of there, maybe to go lock it in my car and come back, or maybe just to leave. But without notice, it wouldn't cross my mind.

But I can't remember the last time I was in someone's home when I didn't already know they were gun owners, other than a couple of women I've dated, and they knew I was into guns.
Some, gun owners even, might think someone is a little goofy, or paranoid, or whatever to go around carrying a gun all the time, but at least I know they're not completely anti-gun.

[dac1842]

No none seems to mind what they don't know..

[tacticool]

That is apples and oranges in my opinion. If you have a store or restaurant you have a place of business open to the public and all that means. It's not the same as a private home. I don't let just anyone into my home and it's certainly not open to the public. If you walk into my home uninvited, you will not be welcome

That's true whether or not they have a gun.

On the other hand, if I invite someone into my home, she's not required by law or good manners to ask my permission for every item in her purse, or ask my permission for her underwear, or ask my permission for her cell phone, or ask my permission for her jewelry, et cetera, ad nauseam.

[PappaGun]

This is why I personally carry in to the homes of others.

You can not predict when some thing will happen.

24/7 and all that.

The party goers at this house were too young to carry.

But I am sure that the people at this party wish that the father was a CHL and carrying.

I will be more careful about observing what might be going on at another's home before I walk in after reading this.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/7278706.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[VMI77]

The smoking may be a poor analogy, but there are some that would argue that secondhand smoke is not harmful inspite of any evidence that says it is. I'm not one of those, but it's my lame defense. It was the best I came up with when posting my opinion.

It doesn't matter to me whether or not it's harmful --it stinks up my house, stinks up my clothes, and makes me cough, so I not only will know someone is smoking, the smoking will directly affect me. If someone with a gun has it properly concealed I won't even know they have it and it will have no affect on me whatsoever.

[ex_dsmr]

To those who pose the opinion that he should ask permission...I offer you this thought:

How many would go ask a store/resteraunt owner if they allowed firearms?
If its not posted, its open season. Is that disrespectful to carry in THEIR establishment without asking first?
What about non 30.06 signs that have no legal bearing?

That is apples and oranges in my opinion. If you have a store or restaurant you have a place of business open to the public and all that means. It's not the same as a private home. I don't let just anyone into my home and it's certainly not open to the public. If you walk into my home uninvited, you will not be welcome and the encounter could be unpleasant. If I have a public business there is the expectation that people will come in uninvited or you will go out of business. In this case if you don't want guns in your business there is a procedure to follow. If you don't follow the procedure than you should have no expectations that others will go along with your wishes.

In my mind there is no common ground here and I can separate the two - business and private property. I remain convinced that your private property (home) is yours and is not within my rights to do whatever I want to do without your permission. Legal rights or not - I still think it is disrespect. We can agree to disagree here.

We can agree to disagree but I think you missed my point entirley. A private business can ask you to disarm or leave. They can refuse you entry or service (so long as they do not discriminate according to federal law) for a variety of reasons. Private businesses enjoy alot of the same benefits that private residences do in that they are free to make their own rules. Break those rules and youll find yourself outside their doorstep. If not, youll be slapped with a tresspassing charge in both instances. Private businesses have the right to restrict yours if they so choose.

Nobody is talking about entering a private residence uninvited.

I find it interesting that the forums are riddled with "improper postings" signs and many choose to ignore that as it does not carry the weight of the law. I dont want to step on any toes but thats alot more inflamatory and disrespectful than entering someones home (with permission) while CC'ing and not telling/asking them.

[A-R]

I find it interesting that the forums are riddled with "improper postings" signs and many choose to ignore that as it does not carry the weight of the law. I dont want to step on any toes but thats alot more inflamatory and disrespectful than entering someones home (with permission) while CC'ing and not telling/asking them.

How is entering a store that is not properly posted 30.06 "inflamatory and disrespectful"? I find any business that attempts to deny my fundamental natural right to defend myself to be extremely disrespectful and thus don't give them my business. Furthermore, the differences between PC 30.05 (general trespassing) and PC 30.06 (trespassing with a gun) are abundantly clear. If a business chooses not to follow the law, why should I be required to interpret what some non-compliant sign really means? As has been said often here, for all we know the business owner truly has no problem with CHL holders entering his store and just posts a non-compliant sign to appease his insurance company or his sheeple customers who feel "safer" seeing a gunbusters sign.

Going about your daily routine while lawfully carrying a firearm is NORMAL and typically uneventful. Why does everyone want to make it seem strange and think they need to request special permission to live their life? And what other CONCEALED facet of your life do you ask permission to bring with you into someone else's premises? Some religions are against eating pork. If I have a ham sandwich for lunch, should I ask a muslim store owner for permission to enter while the yummy pork is still digesting in my belly? What if I have a pigskin football in my backpack, is this OK?

Seriously, where does this whole thought process end?

[chasfm11]

Seriously, where does this whole thought process end?

I cannot speak for others but I think C-dub's post was closest to what the OP was really getting at. Paraphrasing the original post:
- he was visiting relatives, not just another person's house
- he was going to be with that relative's children.
- he was not sure where that part of his family was regarding carrying.
- there were probably a higher than normal chance that he would be outed.

I'm personally not going to get ratcheted up if I find out that I have friends who are not gun friendly or perhaps even antis. I won't discuss my carrying in advance and if I were discovered and they had a problem, I'd quickly leave. That is just the way it goes.

Family can be different and, although I don't have that situation myself, I can empathize with the OP's questioning the situation. There is a good chance that he might be discovered and he was wondering if it would be better to address the matter on his terms, rather than at the time of discovery when some family member's emotions might be higher than necessary. With my own family, I'll often pick the time and place to broach a thorny subject, rather than allowing it to just happen. I'm pretty good on my feet even in conversations that seem to come from nowhere but I can do much better if I can control the flow of the discussion. Walking out of a friend's house is one thing. Walking out of family member's house is something more and potentially has long term consequences. Even if people themselves are OK with guns, sometimes they can quickly get overwrought with guns around their kids. I understand that it isn't a reasonable, rational response but there are parents who have it anyway. I believe that if there is a way to skirt around a potential family conflict, it is worth the time to try but perhaps that is just me.

[Weg]

Talk about a parallel universe, I had the exact same decision to make when I went to Orlando to visit an aunt and uncle. I decided to carry and not say a word. I carried in their house, and the whole time I was with them. No one ever knew and i was never "made". To be honest with you, I have no idea what their opinion of guns/chl are as it never came up in the week that I was there. I even have a " family picture" that was taken in their backyard, every time I see it I chuckle, because I was carrying when the picture was taken. If your confident about your concealment, I would say carry away.

[Texas Dan Mosby]

Do what you think is best.

Car keys, cell phone, wallet, and firearm, are all accessories I neither mention or display unless I find a need to do so.