Wildlife Service kills family pets in Texas

[texanjoker]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

They also go over board sometimes protecting some species.

[Dadtodabone]

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

I reside in rural Montgomery county, my home is on a 3/4 acre lot, that is enclosed by a 6" chain link fence for the backyard and pool area. The remaining area is enclosed at 4" in the same chain link fencing. Last spring my '68 vintage G.M. product sprang a leak in the heater core. The vehicle was parked in the carport, on a concrete pad, and I contained the leaking anti-freeze in a plastic catch pan. After some time on the phone, I was able to locate a replacement part, drove into Houston to purchase it and then repaired my truck. From discovery of the leak to completion of repair was probably 5 hours. During that time I "left anti-freeze out". No small children are part of my household, my pets were contained in the back yard, the entire property is fenced. How were my actions "irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals." ?

[MoJo]

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

I was given my first cat more than 60 years ago, and have had hundreds of them since, not all at once of course, and I am not at all sure that one "owns" a cat.

Like all of God's creatures, they are subject to risks, of nature, weather, other animals, illness, old age, etc. but it requires a deranged and malignant soul to intentionally harm them.

AMEN! Many years ago, a guy I worked with hated cats and would run over them every chance he got until one day swerving to hit a cat he crashed his new truck into a parked car. The insurance company dropped him like a hot potato, and he was forced to pay the high pool rates for a long time.

[RX8er]

Daddy always told me, "Son, don't fall in love with the farm animals" and I have tried to live by that. Now, I have a Standard Schnauzer and she is a family member. She is old and I am not looking forward to the tears that will fall from my eyes as well as my kids when the time comes, soon.

With all that said, if you cannot control your pets and keep them in your yard/house:
1. You should not be a pet owner and if this was an off chance, you should fix the reason and try harder
2. You cannot hold someone else responsible when something happens

If you don't like ht program, let's try to come up with a way they could do it better and hey, maybe cheaper.

And, on a side note, I have seen dogs and cats (along with other animal types) that have been shot and killed because they wonder on airport property and refuse to be chased off or caught. I've also see the aftermath of what a dog and airplane look like after they collide.

[suthdj]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

You totally missed the point. Point being people need to take responsibility for their pets when bad things happen to them as it is their fault for not being proactive. Don't blame the Gov't for setting traps when your animal was not restrained, don't blame your neighbors when our pet was not restrained, don't blame the CHL'r when your pet was not restrained. It is called personal responsibility.

[VMI77]

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

I reside in rural Montgomery county, my home is on a 3/4 acre lot, that is enclosed by a 6" chain link fence for the backyard and pool area. The remaining area is enclosed at 4" in the same chain link fencing. Last spring my '68 vintage G.M. product sprang a leak in the heater core. The vehicle was parked in the carport, on a concrete pad, and I contained the leaking anti-freeze in a plastic catch pan. After some time on the phone, I was able to locate a replacement part, drove into Houston to purchase it and then repaired my truck. From discovery of the leak to completion of repair was probably 5 hours. During that time I "left anti-freeze out". No small children are part of my household, my pets were contained in the back yard, the entire property is fenced. How were my actions "irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals." ?

I was responding to a post that dealt in generalities. You're describing a specific instance that isn't irresponsible, probably not illegal, and not intended to poison animals.

[mamabearCali]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

Not that I know of..he usually comes in at night. He prefers to out his waste in the forested section of our property. If you are so irresponsible as to leave such a toxic liquid out then you will be responsible for the death of anything that might come along including a wandering elementary school kid on his way home. It is not my fixed cat that you or anyone of my neighbors need worry about. It is the feral cat population that is very large and is growing (and causing those 3 am love fights).

[VMI77]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

You totally missed the point. Point being people need to take responsibility for their pets when bad things happen to them as it is their fault for not being proactive. Don't blame the Gov't for setting traps when your animal was not restrained, don't blame your neighbors when our pet was not restrained, don't blame the CHL'r when your pet was not restrained. It is called personal responsibility.

No, I didn't miss the point, I was responding to the example you gave about leaving anti-freeze out. Another poster gave a specific example of conduct that is perfectly acceptable. Your hypothetical was general enough to be interpreted as leaving anti freeze out for the purpose of poisoning or without regard to the potential for poisoning. I do blame the government for setting certain traps in certain locations though, because if I did the same thing I'd be put in prison for placing a booby trap --or any of the other crimes the article claims Wildlife Services is guilty of. What the article talks about is the government violating the law with impunity. Yeah, I get it, we have a lawless unaccountable government, I just don't believe that a lawless irresponsible and unaccountable government is acceptable.

[suthdj]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

Not that I know of..he usually comes in at night. He prefers to out his waste in the forested section of our property. If you are so irresponsible as to leave such a toxic liquid out then you will be responsible for the death of anything that might come along including a wandering elementary school kid on his way home. It is not my fixed cat that you or anyone of my neighbors need worry about. It is the feral cat population that is very large and is growing (and causing those 3 am love fights).

Ok, how about this when the person leaves their dog outside that eats your cat whose fault is that let me guess the dog owner right. People need to stop making excuses, not my pet, kid, etc and face facts. Yes your cat, your kids and so on. When your cat fails to come home some night go look in a mirror when you want to blame someone.

[suthdj]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

You totally missed the point. Point being people need to take responsibility for their pets when bad things happen to them as it is their fault for not being proactive. Don't blame the Gov't for setting traps when your animal was not restrained, don't blame your neighbors when our pet was not restrained, don't blame the CHL'r when your pet was not restrained. It is called personal responsibility.

No, I didn't miss the point, I was responding to the example you gave about leaving anti-freeze out. Another poster gave a specific example of conduct that is perfectly acceptable. Your hypothetical was general enough to be interpreted as leaving anti freeze out for the purpose of poisoning or without regard to the potential for poisoning. I do blame the government for setting certain traps in certain locations though, because if I did the same thing I'd be put in prison for placing a booby trap --or any of the other crimes the article claims Wildlife Services is guilty of. What the article talks about is the government violating the law with impunity. Yeah, I get it, we have a lawless unaccountable government, I just don't believe that a lawless irresponsible and unaccountable government is acceptable.

Yep and ya did it again. you want clear cut example. car leaks on private open driveway cat/dog that is loose and unrestrained due to whatever reason laps it up then dies. No matter how many ways you try to excuse it away it will always fall on the owner for not taking care of their pets. I am not saying the Gov't was any to bright for what they did but give credit to each side for their action/in-action in these events. Responsibilty falls on both sides.

[mamabearCali]

Ok, how about this when the person leaves their dog outside that eats your cat whose fault is that let me guess the dog owner right. People need to stop making excuses, not my pet, kid, etc and face facts. Yes your cat, your kids and so on. When your cat fails to come home some night go look in a mirror when you want to blame someone.

I am not doing anything illegal, immoral, or even socially unacceptable where I live. You have been increasingly hostile. You don't like cats....fine.. You may be angry with some cat owner, I understand that. I have not made excuses I have simply answered your questions. Cats, those that go outside have to accept the risks that go with it. Coyotes, feral dogs, and even cars are part of the risk. Yet most of the cats I have had in my life (around 7 throughout the years) have lived to very ripe old age (10 years plus). Now back to your responsibilities. Don't leave poison out. If you leave poison out for a persons dog, cat, child, that is your under your responsibility.

[mamabearCali]

Yep and ya did it again. you want clear cut example. car leaks on private open driveway cat/dog that is loose and unrestrained due to whatever reason laps it up then dies. No matter how many ways you try to excuse it away it will always fall on the owner for not taking care of their pets. I am not saying the Gov't was any to bright for what they did but give credit to each side for their action/in-action in these events. Responsibilty falls on both sides.

Hold on here. You are preaching responsibility. The car leaked. Now whose responsibility is it to maintain the car and to clean up leaks? An antifreeze leak is a threat to the groundwater too! My cat might eat a few birds, my cat might get eaten by a feral dog. My cat might be squished by a car. All of which effects mostly me. That antifreeze leak is the responsibilty of the car owner to ensure that A. this does not happen or B. it is cleaned up promptly. That can effect groundwater for many.

[VMI77]

Double edge sword. If the owners kept thier pets on a leash/in thier yard that would not happen.

Ever kept a cat on a leash? Or in your yard?

Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea.

- Robert A Heinlein.

Nope I would not own a cat, but just the same it can be kept in the house and I know they escape yadda yadda yadda bottom line is when your pet is dead there is only 1 person to blame.

Why should a cat be kept in the house. It is not against the law or even against courtesy where I live for cats to roam. We fixed our cat so he is not out making babies in this world. He has his shots. He stays generally in the area. Cats will do as cats do. Some cats are made to be indoor cats and some are not. If we kept our cat inside he would be monumentally unhappy. He hunts, catches things (mostly grasshoppers and spiders), enjoys his life.


Aside from that why are they setting dangerous traps where children could be? That is monumentally stupid and of course if someone got hurt they would claim some sort of govt shield from prosecution. Perhaps if govt officials were as liable as the rest of us they would be more careful.

Is your cat out digging up flower beds/gardens so is can crap, is it out. loudly fighting with other cats a 3am so I can't sleep etc..... But yet when you cat dies because somebody left anti-freeze out they are irresponsible, right? As a pet owner you are responible for you animal and all that it does and to the best of my knowledge in TX your pet is to be controlled.

I'm dog person myself, but come on, "left anti-freeze" out? How do you just leave "anti-freeze" out? I don't know what the law is on anti freeze disposal --just that it's illegal to dispose of it in landfills-- but I suspect "just leaving it out" is probably illegal. But aside from that, if you just leave anti freeze "out" how do you know some kid won't get poisoned with it? I'm gonna have to say yeah, just leaving it out is irresponsible, probably illegal, and likely to be for the purpose of poisoning animals.

You totally missed the point. Point being people need to take responsibility for their pets when bad things happen to them as it is their fault for not being proactive. Don't blame the Gov't for setting traps when your animal was not restrained, don't blame your neighbors when our pet was not restrained, don't blame the CHL'r when your pet was not restrained. It is called personal responsibility.

No, I didn't miss the point, I was responding to the example you gave about leaving anti-freeze out. Another poster gave a specific example of conduct that is perfectly acceptable. Your hypothetical was general enough to be interpreted as leaving anti freeze out for the purpose of poisoning or without regard to the potential for poisoning. I do blame the government for setting certain traps in certain locations though, because if I did the same thing I'd be put in prison for placing a booby trap --or any of the other crimes the article claims Wildlife Services is guilty of. What the article talks about is the government violating the law with impunity. Yeah, I get it, we have a lawless unaccountable government, I just don't believe that a lawless irresponsible and unaccountable government is acceptable.

Yep and ya did it again. you want clear cut example. car leaks on private open driveway cat/dog that is loose and unrestrained due to whatever reason laps it up then dies. No matter how many ways you try to excuse it away it will always fall on the owner for not taking care of their pets. I am not saying the Gov't was any to bright for what they did but give credit to each side for their action/in-action in these events. Responsibilty falls on both sides.

Nope, don't care about a clear cut example. I responded to the example YOU gave. Now you want to change the example. I responded to YOU talking about anti-freeze being LEFT OUT. That is NOT a leak....leaving anti-freeze out is a deliberate and intentional act. You have to either open a container or drain anti-freeze into an open container, and then decide to leave it in the open for it to be "left out." When you leave something out YOU make a DECISION to do so. It is a DELIBERATE act, not an accident. It is IRRESPONSIBLE to LEAVE OUT a poison, and in some specific circumstances may be illegal. As I said, I'm a dog person, and though it may be "unfair" I'm not aware of any leash laws for cats. If you LEAVE OUT a poison knowing a cat may drink it, you are deliberately taking an action that you KNOW may lead to poisoning an animal which may be someone's pet. That is irresponsible. You don't like the law, then lobby to put cats under the same law as dogs.

[suthdj]

Yep and ya did it again. you want clear cut example. car leaks on private open driveway cat/dog that is loose and unrestrained due to whatever reason laps it up then dies. No matter how many ways you try to excuse it away it will always fall on the owner for not taking care of their pets. I am not saying the Gov't was any to bright for what they did but give credit to each side for their action/in-action in these events. Responsibilty falls on both sides.

Hold on here. You are preaching responsibility. The car leaked. Now whose responsibility is it to maintain the car and to clean up leaks? An antifreeze leak is a threat to the groundwater too! My cat might eat a few birds, my cat might get eaten by a feral dog. My cat might be squished by a car. All of which effects mostly me. That antifreeze leak is the responsibilty of the car owner to ensure that A. this does not happen or B. it is cleaned up promptly. That can effect groundwater for many.

And you are 100% right. And the death of the animal sill lies on the owner that failed to protect it by keeping it secure.

[suthdj]

Ok, how about this when the person leaves their dog outside that eats your cat whose fault is that let me guess the dog owner right. People need to stop making excuses, not my pet, kid, etc and face facts. Yes your cat, your kids and so on. When your cat fails to come home some night go look in a mirror when you want to blame someone.

I am not doing anything illegal, immoral, or even socially unacceptable where I live. You have been increasingly hostile. You don't like cats....fine.. You may be angry with some cat owner, I understand that. I have not made excuses I have simply answered your questions. Cats, those that go outside have to accept the risks that go with it. Coyotes, feral dogs, and even cars are part of the risk. Yet most of the cats I have had in my life (around 7 throughout the years) have lived to very ripe old age (10 years plus). Now back to your responsibilities. Don't leave poison out. If you leave poison out for a persons dog, cat, child, that is your under your responsibility.

Not hostile and I don't leave chemicals lying around for animals and I don't hate cats. I dislike pet owners that have no respect for their neighbors or their pets lives. You are not picking up on that because you feel I am attacking you, I am not. What I am saying as I have said in every post We pet owners are solely responsible for our pets and their actions if the pet dies because we failed to follow simple common courtesy and in many places the law then we can not blame anyone for the death but ourselves. I can not make this fact any clearer.