UNCLEAR: Public school parking lot

[jimlongley]

Also..... For a PUBLIC school... if the parking lot is posted 30.06, I ignore it. Posting 30.06 on publicly-owned things is not allowed, unless carry is prohibited by statute. For example, posting 30.06 signs on a school building is redundant, but allowed, since CHL in schools is prohibited by law (stupid idea, but there it is). There is a thread here somewhere asking people to post photos and locations of 30.06 signs in places where they are not allowed by statute. The legislature tried to pass a law creating a penalty for anyone posting 30.06 signs in places where the sign is not allowed... Didn't get out of committee, IIRC.

I am not a lawyer. This is my opinion. Not legal advice.

Thank you for the answer, especially the part I quoted above. This was exactly my understanding about the 30.06 at the entrance of a Public School parking lot (in fact, I stated that in one of my replies). Some overzealous school officials don't bother to check the law and post unnecessary and illegal signs. The are just hoping for a scarecrow effect, because I do not believe anyone will be prosecuted for having a firearm in the car in a Public school's parking lot.

Thanks.

Plano Independent School District, which posts their parking lots, says they will prosecute, that they know the law, and that it doesn't apply to them because they are "independent" and therefore not a government agency.

[jmra]

Don't ask, don't tell.

[Abraham]

If I peddle my bike on a school road while band practise is going on am I in violation if I'm carrying?

[jmra]

If I peddle my bike on a school road while band practise is going on am I in violation if I'm carrying?

"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

[TheCytochromeC]

This has come up in these forums many many times. I'll give you the short answer, no. Keep it concealed and safely locked in your car.

IBTL

Thank you. This was my general understanding, but when this topic is discussed in a forum — it gets so BOGGED DOWN by the minutia and nuances, that I cannot see a clear answer. If it was a gray area, I would understand; but I think that this situation is too common for it to be a gray area.

Thank you for your pithy answer...

Not a problem! As you mentioned, there are a million and one things that can affect the particular instance, obfuscating the information which you're seeking. I asked the same question when I joined the forums.

[ATDM]

A CHL holder may keep a concealed handgun on their body anywhere on public school property as long as it is not in the premises. Premises is specifically spelled out as a building or portion of a building. The only time you cannot have one on you on school grounds is if there is a school sponsored activity going on such as band or athletic practice or attending a sporting event on the schools property. You may also disarm and leave your gun in your vehicle if you are going to go into the building. However, as always, you must keep hour handgun concealed at all times.

Thanks. This is pretty clear. I just don't know why some are of the opinion that you can't have your gun concealed and locked in your car at a public school parking lot...

[baldeagle]

A CHL holder may keep a concealed handgun on their body anywhere on public school property as long as it is not in the premises. Premises is specifically spelled out as a building or portion of a building. The only time you cannot have one on you on school grounds is if there is a school sponsored activity going on such as band or athletic practice or attending a sporting event on the schools property. You may also disarm and leave your gun in your vehicle if you are going to go into the building. However, as always, you must keep hour handgun concealed at all times.

It's not that I don't believe you, Keith, but I sure would like to see the cite to the law that states this.

[MeMelYup]

A CHL holder may keep a concealed handgun on their body anywhere on public school property as long as it is not in the premises. Premises is specifically spelled out as a building or portion of a building. The only time you cannot have one on you on school grounds is if there is a school sponsored activity going on such as band or athletic practice or attending a sporting event on the schools property. You may also disarm and leave your gun in your vehicle if you are going to go into the building. However, as always, you must keep hour handgun concealed at all times.

It's not that I don't believe you, Keith, but I sure would like to see the cite to the law that states this.

I think he means this in 46.035. (3) “Premises” means a building or a portion of a building. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.

[jimlongley]

If I peddle my bike on a school road while band practise is going on am I in violation if I'm carrying?

"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Apropos of another thread, if you "peddle" your bike around the school. they'll probably get you for illegally selling your bike, or did you mean "pedal?"

[n5wd]

Whenever you want to know what the law says, you should consult the law, not other people. The law regarding parking lots and concealed weapons is in the Texas Labor Code Chapter 52 Subchapter G Section 52.061 which was added by amending Chapter 52 in the 82nd Legislature in Senate Bill 321. Basically that bill made it legal for an employee to have a weapon in a locked compartment in their car in the employer's parking lot regardless of employer policy regarding firearms on their property.

There are, however, exceptions to the exemption.

Sec. 52.062.
EXCEPTIONS. (a) Section 52.061 does not:
(1) authorize a person who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses a firearm, or who lawfully possesses ammunition to possess a firearm or ammunition on any property where the possession of a firearm or ammunition is prohibited by state or federal law; or
(2) apply to:
(A) a vehicle owned or leased by a public or private employer and used by an employee in the course and scope of the employee’s employment, unless the employee is required to transport or store a firearm in the official discharge of the employee’s duties;
(B) a school district;
(C) an open-enrollment charter school, as defined by Section 5.001, Education Code;
(D) a private school, as defined by Section 22.081, Education Code;

I can't find anything in the Texas Education Code that defines what a school district is, so I think it would take an opinion from the Attorney General Abbott's office to know for sure, but it appears to me, given that the law specifically exempts open-enrollment charter schools as well as private schools from the protection of 52.061, that you cannot have a weapon in your car in the parking lot of a public school either.

IANAL. Perhaps a lawyer could express an opinion regarding this issue.

The Attorney General's office did express an opinion about this law but did not specifically address the issue of school districts.

Please remember that this section of the Labor Code applies to School District employees, and not the general public that uses the school. Yes, a district can adopt language in their rules and employee contracts that tell employees that they can not have weapons in their cars, but absent a specific rule or contract provision, the law (PC 46.035) defines premises as the building and any portions of the buildings, and not parking lots or roadways.

But a school district, by virtue of it being a government entity, even if it is an independent school district (independent just means that it is a separate government entity and not part of the county or city government) does not have the authority to enforce 30.06according to the law - but, then, no one wants to be the test case either. Until there's case law, all one can do is follow the law as best they read it.

[RoyGBiv]

Plano Independent School District, which posts their parking lots, says they will prosecute, that they know the law, and that it doesn't apply to them because they are "independent" and therefore not a government agency.

My property taxes go to pay my local ISD. If they were a " private" business id be taking a longer vacation every summer. Obligation to pay? Public. Cant be posted legally, IMO.

Im not terribly worried about ther incorrect understanding of the statute. Im willing to be a test case on that one if it becomes necessary.

[ATDM]

If I peddle my bike on a school road while band practise is going on am I in violation if I'm carrying?

"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Apropos of another thread, if you "peddle" your bike around the school. they'll probably get you for illegally selling your bike, or did you mean "pedal?"

That's funny...

[Abraham]

jimlongley,

Lucky I didn't post "paddle", but yes, pedal is what I meant.

I pedal my bike and paddle my kayak.

Now, if I could say that three times in a row...

[n5wd]

jimlongley,

Lucky I didn't post "paddle", but yes, pedal is what I meant.

I pedal my bike and paddle my kayak.

Now, if I could say that three times in a row...

Just don't piddle while you paddle or when you pedal.

[jimlongley]

Plano Independent School District, which posts their parking lots, says they will prosecute, that they know the law, and that it doesn't apply to them because they are "independent" and therefore not a government agency.

My property taxes go to pay my local ISD. If they were a " private" business id be taking a longer vacation every summer. Obligation to pay? Public. Cant be posted legally, IMO.

Im not terribly worried about ther incorrect understanding of the statute. Im willing to be a test case on that one if it becomes necessary.

Amen, but just telling you what PISD has told me and others in the past.