Probation, stand your ground, peaceful journey...etc.

[Dannyboy]

Hello everyone,

I believe heavily in the 2nd amendment, and that I have the right to defend myself and the things that make life meaningful to me.

I'm not a convicted felon, but I was charged with a felony in 2009, and was given deferred adjudicated probation in 2010. Completed 3 years of probation successfully.

It's my understanding now, that I cannot get a CHL until 2020? Is it 10 years from the date of the judgement?

Next question: Then am I to understand I cannot defend myself in public with a gun? I know I can legally possess, own, buy, and sell guns. If Im in my home, I can shoot an intruder.

Can I carry a gun in my car at all times? I read I can carry a gun from my house to my car. Then once the gun is in the car, does it have to be in the open? What about while the car is parked? I don't want a violent criminal seeing the gun, breaking into the car, and killing someone in a robbery, or whatever...

What all can I do? I can hunt. Target practice. Defend my home. Buy and sell guns. But am I to understand I cannot under any circumstances carry a gun on my person legally until the time has expired, for the non conviction?

If Im in a situation like San Bernadino - say Im at a company party or pubic event, and terrorists or mass shooters show up, and I pull a pistol and kill them before they kill everyone in the room, will I go to jail for illegally carrying? Think about these kinds of very realistic scenarios...

[Barman84]

Technically...

Federal law prohibits you from owning a firearm. State law doesn't. Its 10 years from when you were released from probation not from the original date as well.

They are trying to pass new federal law that allows non-violent felonies to still posses firearms.

Additionally, carrying in your car has to be out of site at all times unless you get your CHL and open carry. Technically its illegal to have a pistol in plain site in your vehicle.

[ScottDLS]

Technically...

Federal law prohibits you from owning a firearm. State law doesn't. Its 10 years from when you were released from probation not from the original date as well.

They are trying to pass new federal law that allows non-violent felonies to still posses firearms.

Additionally, carrying in your car has to be out of site at all times unless you get your CHL and open carry. Technically its illegal to have a pistol in plain site in your vehicle.

A state deferred adjudication is not considered a conviction for Federal GCA 1968 purposes, so OP is not a prohibited person. But it does count for CHL until the 10 years is up.

[Dannyboy]

I believe you're wrong about that. Federal law would prohibit me from owning a firearm IF i had been convicted. Otherwise, why is it that Im able to walk into anyplace that sells firearms, and my background check always clears? No, the federal law would only apply to me if I were a convicted felon, which I am not.

[AJSully421]

Get the DA non-disclosed and you can apply for a CHL the next day.

[couzin]

Danny boy - you are in error and your DA/probation is considered a felony conviction unless plead to misdemeanor. More info is needed on the type of crime as noted on th DPS LTC FAQ:

"..Texas Government Code Chapter 411, Subchapter H states that deferred adjudication will be considered the same as a conviction. Depending on the type of offense and the date of the order of deferred adjudication, you may not be eligible for a LTC. See GC §411.171 and §411.1711"

[Dannyboy]

Again, Im allowed to purchase and own firearms. Just not a CHL. The law is very clear about this. The Deferred Adjudicated Probation ONLY affected my ability to get a CHL. Not to own, or purchase. If this was the case, I would not be able to walk into a gun shop, and purchase firearms after they clear me on a background check. What you copied and pasted above clarifies all this. It only refers to LTC, not ownership. There is no law against me having guns in my home, or to carry one from my house to my vehicle. Here's what Im banking on:

20(a) of Article 42.12 of the Texas Code of Criminal Procedure as creating two types of relief, one mandatory and the other discretionary. Mandatory relief has been described by Texas appellate courts as the usual – most common – disposition, which merely consists of a “discharge” from community supervision. The second – and least common – form of relief has been described by Texas appellate courts as “judicial clemency,” which consists of a dismissal of criminal charges and a release “from all penalties and disabilities” that resulted from the offense.

Hence, the word "relief." I plan to make a few calls this coming week to verify what Ive already been told by people in San Antonio who operate a local gun club/firing range.

[couzin]

I was not addressing your ability to purchase, just the LTC and your statement that the deferred adjudication was not a conviction ("...IF I had been convicted...") - two seperate animals here. A State felony does not always turn into a prohibition at the Federal level for ownership or possession of a firearm, especially a conviction served out in probation, even some jail felonies, but rarely State prison, and none that I know of when a Federal felony crime. Okie dokie?!

[Dannyboy]

Okie Dokie then. Looking back over the course of the discussion, it seems obvious you were addressing both the CHL and the right to own. Thanks for all the info.

Now, Im wondering what I can do to have an exception made for getting a CHL. Wonder if a good lawyer could make something happen? Any experience there you can share with me? Thanks again.

And, it actually doesn't count as a conviction. Otherwise, I would not be able to own, nor would be able to vote. I can do both at this time, whereas people I know who went the route of 1244 A, or got a guilty verdict from a jury, or simply pled guilty, are prohibited for life from owning.

Convicted felons cannot legally purchase, own, carry, etc. Or vote.

[gdanaher]

Find a good attorney who knows this area of the law and get an opinion.

[The Annoyed Man]

I mean absolutely no disrespect, but how does probation not equal a conviction? Isn't probation the result of having been found guilty (convicted) of something?

Just trying to understand.......

[AJSully421]

I mean absolutely no disrespect, but how does probation not equal a conviction? Isn't probation the result of having been found guilty (convicted) of something?

Just trying to understand.......

He is using a strange series of words to describe it. Deferred Adjudication is NOT what one might call "Straight Probation" in that a DA does not have a conviction yet, and is predicated on staying out of trouble.

OP, You can petition for an order of non-disclosure after 5 years from when your probation was complete, not when you were put on it. Any decent Criminal Defense attorney will be able to talk to you about the eligibility and process for getting it non-disclosed. Doing this will knock 5 years off of your waiting time.

[Dannyboy]

Sully best explained it. Its like this. The DA looked at my case. Neither of us wanted trial. I asked for deferred adjudicated probation. That means i promised to live up to the conditions of felony probation, and if. I. Completed those conditions, there will not be a conviction on my record. Only a charge, which is now deferred. I never plead guilty, and there never was a trial. Its one of those weird curve balls in the law. If i failed the probation though, my ass ws going down the river for the maximum time for a state jail felony, no early release or parole for good time.

If youre wondering, i got busted for weed. I want to get a CHL, so i can put a 357 round into someone who tries that _______ they pulled in San Bernadino, or in movie theatres, or other peaceful events. Terrorists are here, and so are nutcases. I want to be able to respond instead of watch.

[twomillenium]

They are felonies then, that are misdemeanors now. Punishment and fines have changed too. There is a legal way to get things espunged, pardoned or ND (non-disclosed).

The old saying "don't do the crime if you can't do the time" was not talking about just jail time. Good luck

[Dannyboy]

The point is, i have no felony convictions, even though i was charged with a felony, and agreed to probation. That was the deal i offered the DA. I didnt lose my civil rights, which is automatic for a felony conviction. Thete are no misdemeanor convictions from that case either. No trial, no plea, no confession.