Dangerous for children to play license plate game now.

[VoiceofReason]

The children were 8 and 5 and while it is conceivable that children that age could or would do property damage it is not very likely. It is also just as likely as kids running around peeking in cars as the kids were just running around. It is also possible that they (being with their grandmother) ran to the wrong type of car, then ran back to their grandmothers car.

DISCRETION! COMMON SENSE! I can call in and say anything I darn well please and most likely will face no consequences for it, but what damage has been done. It does not matter how many officer friendly interactions these kids have now, they will remember what happened. A grandmother will likely have PTSD and panic attacks for nothing. How much could have been solved with a simpler stop that did not treat people like escaped prisoners.

What she said.

[txglock21]

The caller needs to be slapped. Depending on which officers stopped them there may have been some Barney Fifedom in play. The SPs are military and I have never had a problem with any of them, while the contract security are security guards with extra training. Once, while on board Lackland, I got pulled over by one of those guys and he started to dress me down about an inspection sticker being out. He told me to wait there while he called the SPs. When they showed up, he apologized and simply asked I get taken care of as soon as practical. He rolled his eyes at the contractor and took him aside to speak with him as we left.

A company I worked for was going to put me to the training, Langley IIRC, it but they lost the contract. That's how I know what is involved. The one that stopped me couldn't even write a ticket, which I am sure he would have loved to do but had to call the SPs.

For those not of military background, an MP (Military Police) is Army, SPs in Navy and Marines are "Shore Patrol" or at least used to be, while SP in the Air Force is "Security Police". Joint bases go to whichever is the predominant service on board. JRB Carswell is Navy run.

You are correct sir, but just to add, a SP in the Air Force is broken down even further to that there is SS (Security Specialist) and LE (Law Enforcement Specialist). SS is more of a security guard and LE is more of base police. BUT, depending on the AF base, both can do either job. I was SS, but at Osan AB in South Korea, I did LE and town patrol duties more than flight line guard.

[Purplehood]

The caller needs to be slapped. Depending on which officers stopped them there may have been some Barney Fifedom in play. The SPs are military and I have never had a problem with any of them, while the contract security are security guards with extra training. Once, while on board Lackland, I got pulled over by one of those guys and he started to dress me down about an inspection sticker being out. He told me to wait there while he called the SPs. When they showed up, he apologized and simply asked I get taken care of as soon as practical. He rolled his eyes at the contractor and took him aside to speak with him as we left.

A company I worked for was going to put me to the training, Langley IIRC, it but they lost the contract. That's how I know what is involved. The one that stopped me couldn't even write a ticket, which I am sure he would have loved to do but had to call the SPs.

For those not of military background, an MP (Military Police) is Army, SPs in Navy and Marines are "Shore Patrol" or at least used to be, while SP in the Air Force is "Security Police". Joint bases go to whichever is the predominant service on board. JRB Carswell is Navy run.

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

If the plates did indeed come back as belonging to a stolen vehicle (whether the caller gave an accurate recitation of the plates or not), I would tend to support the stop.

[MechAg94]

[quote="PurplehoodMarines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

If the plates did indeed come back as belonging to a stolen vehicle (whether the caller gave an accurate recitation of the plates or not), I would tend to support the stop.[/quote]
I might support the initial stop also, but once they saw it was a grandmother and two small kids, they should immediately start double checking infomration. They don't fit the profile.

I also find it hard to believe that small kids running around looking at license plates were mistaken for car burglars. That is odd.

[Dad24GreatKids]

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

If the plates did indeed come back as belonging to a stolen vehicle (whether the caller gave an accurate recitation of the plates or not), I would tend to support the stop.

I might support the initial stop also, but once they saw it was a grandmother and two small kids, they should immediately start double checking infomration. They don't fit the profile.

I also find it hard to believe that small kids running around looking at license plates were mistaken for car burglars. That is odd.

There seem to be more and more news stories where kids are being involved in crimes by their parents when an offense is committed. It's sad, but some people use children as a way to shield themselves or redirect suspicion.

[OldCurlyWolf]

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

If the plates did indeed come back as belonging to a stolen vehicle (whether the caller gave an accurate recitation of the plates or not), I would tend to support the stop.

I might support the initial stop also, but once they saw it was a grandmother and two small kids, they should immediately start double checking infomration. They don't fit the profile.

I also find it hard to believe that small kids running around looking at license plates were mistaken for car burglars. That is odd.

There seem to be more and more news stories where kids are being involved in crimes by their parents when an offense is committed. It's sad, but some people use children as a way to shield themselves or redirect suspicion.

I hate to be the bearer of unwelcome news(not really, I just said that ), but using children as shields or as a mode of misdirection is centuries old. I seriously doubt that the oldest occurrence was much past the time of cave drawings.

[K.Mooneyham]

Why do I get the distinct feeling that the security folks that did this were the "rent-a-cops" that many of the military installations have hired? Meaning that I doubt they were actual uniformed military personnel. To be honest, most airmen would rather not have some sort of a problem, if only because they don't want to do any more paperwork.

On a different note, the USAF calls their military police career field "Security Forces". Can't remember when it changed from LE and SP, but some years ago (many years ago?) they merged the two to make the SF career field; that career field also absorbed CATM, which are the folks who do small arms training for the USAF.

[Purplehood]

Why do I get the distinct feeling that the security folks that did this were the "rent-a-cops" that many of the military installations have hired? Meaning that I doubt they were actual uniformed military personnel. To be honest, most airmen would rather not have some sort of a problem, if only because they don't want to do any more paperwork.

On a different note, the USAF calls their military police career field "Security Forces". Can't remember when it changed from LE and SP, but some years ago (many years ago?) they merged the two to make the SF career field; that career field also absorbed CATM, which are the folks who do small arms training for the USAF.

I grew up an Air Force brat. Law Enforcement on Air Bases back in the 60-70's were referred to as the Air Police (AP). That went away when it became common usage to refer to them as APE's.

[txglock21]

The caller needs to be slapped. Depending on which officers stopped them there may have been some Barney Fifedom in play. The SPs are military and I have never had a problem with any of them, while the contract security are security guards with extra training. Once, while on board Lackland, I got pulled over by one of those guys and he started to dress me down about an inspection sticker being out. He told me to wait there while he called the SPs. When they showed up, he apologized and simply asked I get taken care of as soon as practical. He rolled his eyes at the contractor and took him aside to speak with him as we left.

A company I worked for was going to put me to the training, Langley IIRC, it but they lost the contract. That's how I know what is involved. The one that stopped me couldn't even write a ticket, which I am sure he would have loved to do but had to call the SPs.

For those not of military background, an MP (Military Police) is Army, SPs in Navy and Marines are "Shore Patrol" or at least used to be, while SP in the Air Force is "Security Police". Joint bases go to whichever is the predominant service on board. JRB Carswell is Navy run.

You are correct sir, but just to add, a SP in the Air Force is broken down even further to that there is SS (Security Specialist) and LE (Law Enforcement Specialist). SS is more of a security guard and LE is more of base police. BUT, depending on the AF base, both can do either job. I was SS, but at Osan AB in South Korea, I did LE and town patrol duties more than flight line guard.

I just wanted to add: this was back in the middle to late 80's, it may have changed since then.

[Dragonfighter]

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

Ah. Thanks for the clarification. I've got a fair amount of time on forts, bases and stations, very limited on camps. Except for the rare trip to a Marine Air Station (MCAS) for Space-A.

[Purplehood]

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

Ah. Thanks for the clarification. I've got a fair amount of time on forts, bases and stations, very limited on camps. Except for the rare trip to a Marine Air Station (MCAS) for Space-A.

Keep in mind that the last time I was on a Marine Corps Base was 1993. Things may have changed since then.

I found out that the unit I was in is no longer even called "FSSG", it is something completely different now.

[philip964]

BTW the air force has apologized in public, but not directly to the family.

http://pvpost.com/2014/04/16/error-from ... rney-26688" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Apparently police have automatic license plate scanners now mounted on their cars. They mistake 2 and 7. Here an attorney in his BMW is stopped, pinned in by police, who approach his vehicle with guns drawn, but not pointed at him. The scanner said the Oldsmobile was stolen.

Prairie Village is a small well heeled crime free bedroom community in Kansas City.

[The Annoyed Man]

Marines can be a member of the Shore Patrol, but on their own installations they are Military Police.

If the plates did indeed come back as belonging to a stolen vehicle (whether the caller gave an accurate recitation of the plates or not), I would tend to support the stop.

I might support the initial stop also, but once they saw it was a grandmother and two small kids, they should immediately start double checking infomration. They don't fit the profile.

I also find it hard to believe that small kids running around looking at license plates were mistaken for car burglars. That is odd.

[sarcasm]Profiling is bad. Ba-a-a-a-a-a-a-d. You should never profile anybody.[/sarcasm]

“We sincerely regret the fact that their enjoyable day at the museum ended with this high-risk traffic stop,” their statement read, according to the Dayton News. “Had the vehicle not originally come back as stolen, this situation would have been resolved with a quick courtesy stop of the vehicle to clarify the initial report.”

It wasn't a high risk stop. If he spoke honestly, he would say "We sincerely regret the fact that their enjoyable day at the museum ended up with this erroneous high-risk traffic stop".

“All we can do at this point is offer our apology to the Hills,” Barlow added. “And we’ve invited them to come out to the base and meet the security forces.”

But despite the apology, Wendy says the damage may already have been done to her son.

“My son doesn’t trust police officers now,” Wendy Hill said. “He views them as the bad guy.”

Sadly, the damage has been done, and one more child has been taught (by the police) that the police are the enemy.......and it didn't have to be this way. This kind of response is right up there with TSA doing body cavity searches on wheelchair-bound grandmas from Smalltown USA.